Comments on: On Rattling Sabres With Russia

Ben Stein Thinks It's Dumb To Say We'll Fight Russis At Its Borders When We Can't And Won't

[alexxxx1-2009]

...Continued

3. %u201CWe''re not going to fight the Russians over Poland, which is right next to Russia and about 5,000 miles from us%u201D %u2013 Wow! This is dangerous foolishness for sure. Poland is a NATO member. So you don%u2019t like to be called %u201Cliars and punks%u201D but you don%u2019t mind being a traitor? Do you suggest us to come back pre-Napoleon times, mid-17th century when every state was fighting for its own survival. It%u2019s a little bit outdated concept given to the fact that it doesn%u2019t take much to destroy our planet nowadays. Lots of countries have this potential. And second, how long would it take for a ballistic missile to cross 5,000 miles? 15 %u2013 20 minutes, I would guess. That%u2019s how far you are from the nuclear holocaust. Always!
Therefore, we have got to do something
to stop this war, future wars,
to preserve the supremacy of the law of agreements rather than the law of jungles,
to save lives of our kids from potentially dangerous spread of revanchist spirit that would bring them to war sooner rather than later.

Regards
Alex

[alexxxx1-2009]

...Continued
2. Yes, the US got too many fights on its platter. The seemingly endless Afghanistan and Iraq, the upcoming Iran, the very shaky position in the American underbelly with Venezuela and Bolivia. It%u2019s all true as well as true is the literal fight for survival of its own American economy. But%u2026 That%u2019s where the politics and the politicians must distinguish themselves from the crowd and find a way to reach the goal beyond the obvious battlefield. I%u2019ve never been a big fan of the Bush%u2019s administration. Nonetheless, the very fact that they found a courage to save peace and transform the fight to oppose the revanchist Russia into the economic political spheres, tells me that the American political establishment still has lots of potential. They sure realized some would call them liars and punks.
Continued...

[alexxxx1-2009]

Dear Ben,
Everything said below can be treated as a punch below the belt. But your short article made me think that%u2019s the last resort to be used to bring people like you, smart and good intentioned, back to continence.
1. Scroll the history exactly 70 years back to September 30, 1938. Rings any bell? Historians say it all started with the Munich Agreement of 1938 when France and Britain sanctioned the annexation of Czechoslovakia, thinking %u201CWell, what%u2019s Sudetenland to us? And where exactly is it? This is dangerous foolishness. Hitler, standing up for the Czech Germans, may be right.%u201D Parallels are so obvious that it doesn%u2019t take your education, your IQ and the experience to see them.
Let Kremlin rearrange the world map and your grandchildren will end up on a war plane to Europe heavily armed on a mission to fight for Britain or France in just a few short years. I%u2019m begging you, please don%u2019t let you grandchildren die in a flame of WW3. Please don%u2019t make them think their grandpa was so short sighted that he couldn%u2019t spot obvious signs of aggression to be opposed immediately regardless where it comes from, Russia or China, Iraq or Syria.
I%u2019m not a big fan of metaphors in a political reasoning but may I say, you have to strengthen the frame and put some extra support to it if your (or our) house of world peace among the world leading countries is falling apart. Do nothing and you%u2019ll lose the house (peace).
...Continued

[alexxxx1-2009]

Dear Ben,
Everything said below can be treated as a punch below the belt. But your short article made me think that%u2019s the last resort to be used to bring people like you, smart and good intentioned, back to continence.
1. Scroll the history exactly 70 years back to September 30, 1938. Rings any bell? Historians say it all started with the Munich Agreement of 1938 when France and Britain sanctioned the annexation of Czechoslovakia, thinking %u201CWell, what%u2019s Sudetenland to us? And where exactly is it? This is dangerous foolishness. Hitler, standing up for the Czech Germans, may be right.%u201D Parallels are so obvious that it doesn%u2019t take your education, your IQ and the experience to see them.
Let Kremlin rearrange the world map and your grandchildren will end up on a war plane to Europe heavily armed on a mission to fight for Britain or France in just a few short years. I%u2019m begging you, please don%u2019t let you grandchildren die in a flame of WW3. Please don%u2019t make them think their grandpa was so short sighted that he couldn%u2019t spot obvious signs of aggression to be opposed immediately regardless where it comes from, Russia or China, Iraq or Syria.
I%u2019m not a big fan of metaphors in a political reasoning but may I say, you have to strengthen the frame and put some extra support to it if your (or our) house of world peace among the world leading countries is falling apart. Do nothing and you%u2019ll lose the house (peace).
...Continued

[skoplowitz1]

Mr. Stein said, "We''ve promised the Poles we''ll defend them if Russia attacks."

"This is dangerous foolishness. We''re not going to fight the Russians over Poland, which is right next to Russia and about 5,000 miles from us."

I am astounded a man of his intelligence could make such a statement. Would we defend England or France if Russia attacked them? Of course we would. We are all part of the NATO alliance, and so is Poland. We have made an agreement to defend Poland and the other four former communist countries should invasions occur.

[tombost3]

When US needed help in Iraq Georgia had sent 2,500 soldiers, and it was not even obliged to do that because it is not a member of NATO. Georgia had sent the third largest amount of troops after US and Britain. Please think about this.

[snowdog26usa]

The time has come for almighty%u2019s one%u2019s to nock at that new gate
post..by snowdog26USA

[snowdog26usa]

The time has come for almighty%u2019s one%u2019s to nock at that new gate
post..by snowdog26USA

[incog-nito]

"Think back to Grenada when US military went in to rescue those in Richmond Hill prison, the students, etc."

Posted by vargsriket

Psst... Those students were not taken prisoners. In fact some of them were studying and didn''t even know the U.S. was coming to "rescue" them. It''s pretty easy to come up with a pretext to attack another country, you know. History abounds with such examples.

[boelcke1916]

We need to pick our fights carefully since our military is over-extended all over the globe. I feel sorry for Georgia, but this is not a fight we can safely make. And, they are not in NATO. We have provoked Russia enough. Now they are arming Venezuela. I think Russia is sending us a message.

[vargsriket]

And one last thing, in my opinion it''s definitely a double standard when the nation that did NOT start the conflict is blamed. The response was too hard and "disproportionate"? Can someone tell me what would be a proper and proportional response to a military force that is shelling your own civilian population? Heh, like the US ever holds back.... It''s all about firepower superiority and air control. Russia waged this war smart, just like the US would, supressing fire points with overwhelming firepower, taking out communication, establishing air superiority and pouring mechanized units and ground troops to wrest control. Very much by the book.

[vargsriket]

When the Dutch UN troops stood aside and didn''t get involved to stop the Srebrenica massacre, because of UN rules of engagement, result was probably the worst massacre in Eirope since WW2. What country is going to stand aside and watch their citizens get massacred from the sideline? Russians were warning for MONTHS that the Georgians are preparing to attack South Ossetia, why didn''t the world heed? During the initial hours of the Georgian onslaught, the world''s media was eerily silent.. I guess if it''s not American citizens getting killed, it''s not really newsworthy... Only when the """agressor""" Russia punched Georgia in the face, the sirens went off. I can''t stand the double standard when it comes to Russia, it''s so blatantly evident. The west just needs to understand that 21st century Russia!=USSR, there are no more imperialist ambitions, all they want is to be accepted as equals in trade, culture, business, etc.

[vargsriket]

Just because it''s within your territory doesn''t mean that you can kill your own citizens.. or does it? US didn''t stop Rwanda, Darfur, Congo, etc etc. But this doesn''t make it right. If Russia didn''t intervene, who knows how many would have died, the way the Georgians were conducting the assault, it was obvious that civilian casualties were last on their mind.

Having an irresponsible hothead ally like Saakashvili in NATO would be irresponsible, how can you rely on him not to poke the Russian bear. Georgians attacked Russian peacekeeping forces directly, surrounded the compound in the first hours and fired with tanks upon the base with direct line of sight, killing 15 and wounding over 70 Russian soldiers. If this is not provocation, I don''t know what is. And with this missile "shield" next to Russia''s border.... How would the US react if Russia decided to build their own missile "shield" in, lets say, Cuba? Oh wait, that almost triggered WW3....

[vargsriket]

Good article Mr. Stein.

I''m just thinking if it was 50,000+ American citizens being shelled indiscriminately in Tskhinvali and not Russians, there would be a whole different rhetoric used now. America defends its citizens, just as any country should and most do. No matter where these people are, whose sovereign soil, if scores of American lives are in danger, the US comes to their aid. Think back to Grenada when US military went in to rescue those in Richmond Hill prison, the students, etc. When Americans were taken hostage in 1980 in Iran, how did America react? By creating an ultra-elite CT force (Delta) and attempting to rescue them, even though the op failed. Did Iran''s soveignty matter then? Or Grenada''s? Or Pakistan''s, according to recent developments that have come to light that Bush OK''d Special OPs units to go into their territory and airstrikes, apparently killing some civilians? In Afghanistan about 3 weeks ago something like 90 civilians died in an erroneous airstrike, just as news came out that Russian air force attacked Gori and accidentally wounding and killing around 15 civilians. Terrible? You bet, sad but true, civilians bear the brunt of violence in a conflict, but all over the news were the same 5 pictures of bloodied Georgians in Gori and maybe 3-4 paragraph story about the dead Afghani civilians.

[noboundary]

"Russia will always lie and renege on any treaty it has signed if it is allowed to do so by inaction and tacit permissiveness"

That is exactly how the young United States dealt with its earliest native inhabitants. And now, the republicans base their power on its ability to lie to the American public and get away with it - it looks like the liars will win.

[blackwater66-2009]

All I know is that only Big John McCain can save us from these evil doer''s and terrorist sympathizers around the world. We must continue the Bush legacy and pursue these murders wherever they hide. McCain and Palin will do just this as soon as they are sworn in office. ATTACK ! ATTACK ! ATTACK !!!

[tbweb]

`Why are we getting into all these messes so far from home? Why are we provoking the Russians needlessly?`

Pres. Bush doesn`t know what a `Lame Duck` is, he thinks a `Lame Duck` is a bird wounded by a Cheney outing at the shooting range.

[incog-nito]

For once I completely agree with Ben Stein. But he missed one important point. He mentioned that we don''t have the means to fight Russia, but did not say why. The debacle in Iraq and Afghanistan is why. It ties up military resources and makes America look weak in the eyes of her enemies.

[tscc2]

The cold war *** for tat strategy will completely fail us going forward. We have to face the world is growing up without us and it is better to compete on technology, the environment and jobs. That is what Russia wants; it is America that wants a war economy. Oil and War that is the Republican platform. They know nothing else. The conservatives are just being manipulated by the Republican Party and Karl Rove for fear votes to retain power. The Bush doctrine of "War brings Peace" is completely contrary to our American traditions and is a perversion of who we are. We are better than that.

[boelcke1916]

Ben Stein is right. We need to start working with the Russians for a real peace and stop being so belligerent toward them. We have some blame for what is happening over there. The Cold War was awful the first time. Let''s not start that up again. Russia should be made into a friend and ally. The Europeans and us have no reason to start a fight with them.