It is proper for BSA to reevaluate it's position on Gay scouts and scout leaders. The religious community is NOT all behind the literal interpretation of the current translation of the bible. There are a good number of churches and theologians that have explained that the literal reading of the bible is not accurate, that to understand the writings one must understand the writings in the context of the times and the writers intent, and to especially understanding that Christ did not support discrimination (noting that the bible has been used for centuries to discriminate against blacks as well as men who have sex with other men). So, it is desirable for the BSA not to align it's position with any Christian group but to be neutral in this religious conflict (and to be more Christ like and to not discriminate against gay youth and youth leaders). You might want to check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_and_Christianity and to look at what is explained in books like http://www.jaymichaelson.net/godvsgay/ (no endorsements here - just an example). Please note - a LOT of religions deamonize other religions and denominations that don't agree with them - statements that one's religion is flawless is based on the teachings/brain-washing (over many years) of their members (and as meny people they can get to accept their positions).
Listening to the Gay men I have know and know, boys figure out whether they are gay from age 5 on up (many in their teens and after). Many of them were in families which chose to discriminate against homosexuals and they suppressed their feelings (from news stories many are kicked out of their homes and some even commit suicide which is most unfortunate). No guy wants to be bullied, attached, killed, etc . so those who can suppress their feelings do suppress their feelings. The right wing media and right wing religions paint homosexually very negatively (also referring to all gays as effeminate which is totally wrong - most gays I know are not effeminate at all). So, gay boys suppressing their feelings are in the boy scouts now - and will continue to be in the scouts (it would be healthier if gay boys could be out otherwise all one is doing is protecting right wing Christian bigots from knowing they are around Gay boys, and to allow bigots (boys and adults) to continue to harass any boy they believe is gay).
Now a comment on whether homosexuality is genetic or not. First, let's get the difference between homosexuals and gays out and on the table. Homosexuals are any guy who has sex with other guys which can include totally straight guys who just want to have some fun. Gay guys are guys who are truly attracted to other guys and have the ability to (later) love guys (as a straight person would love a girl friend or wife). So, when one talks about gays, let's not confuse straight homosexuals who are not gay at all (maybe bi for sex) and Gay guys who are truly gay.
Next, let's understand how gay's are made (excluding straight guys having fun with other men). Common reasons presented are that it is genetic, god makes gays that way (remember, Christians' believe in a spirit and that spirit may be gay), some gays may be influenced to be gay, or some may be recruited. Let's dismiss the last two (influenced or recruited) because no guy would ever want to be referred to as gay after recognizing how gays are discriminated against, assaulted, killed, etc. - no guy would ever do this voluntarily. So, it is then genetic or the person's spirit as created by God. So far the studies of genetics are inconclusive but some studies have interesting findings (like I heard that in 70% of twins where 1 guy is gay the other is gay) and the fact that around 1.5% of the male population is said to be gay - which is not an insignificant number of people (noting most all are born by fathers and mothers who are straight). The other option is that a person's spirit is truly gay spirit created by God - I don't know of any group that has looked into this adequately (certainly the religions that insist on a literal transition would never come up with any adequate study to determine whether a spirit is truly straight, gay, or transgender). So - one is left with the fact that gay guys figure out that they are gay somehow (long and most likely painful process in most cases) and most all I have talked to say they were born that way (often after years of suppressing their feelings and trying to fit into the religious culture of their parents/church, even saying they chose to be this way when there was really no choice involved at all - the only choice they have is to try to be straight).
Comments given in some posts I've seen say that gays should be separated from straight campers (bathrooms, etc). This is totally laughable. Give all boys some credit and tell them they shouldn't play around and straight guys will not become gay (if gay - they are born that way).
The homosexual movement's national agenda being forced upon the BSA...
You may want to read this article to enlighten yourself against our amoral secular public media and it's myths about homosexuality.
Three main studies are cited by "gay rights" activists in support of their argument—Hamer's X-chromosome research, LeVay's study of the hypothalamus, and Bailey and Pillard's study of identical twins who were homosexuals.
In all three cases, the researchers had a vested interest in obtaining a certain outcome because they were homosexuals themselves. More importantly, their studies did not stand up to scientific scrutiny by other researchers. Also, "the media typically do not explain the methodological flaws in these studies, and they typically oversimplify the results." There is no reliable evidence to date that homosexual behaviour is determined by a person's genes.
To the extent that biological or social factors may contribute to a person's bent toward homosexual behaviour, this does not excuse it. Some people have a strong bent towards stealing or abuse of alcohol, but they still choose to engage or not engage in this behaviour—the law rightly holds them accountable.
The final report of the BUWA task force states "that a person becomes a homosexual ultimately by choosing to be involved in same-sex activity . . . . This is in contrast to innate characteristics such as gender and ethnicity." The report affirms that "the Bible is clear that sin involves choice, and it unequivocally condemns homosexual behaviour as sin."
The charade of gay rights is reminiscent of the character Leonardo Di Caprio portrayed in the movie "Catch Me If You Can". On a toned down scale thousands of successful homosexuals have conned America into believing homosexuality is normal. They are the Anderson Coopers and Barney Franks of the world and all are capable of representing as regular guys and gals but underneath is a very sick mind, not much different than Frank Abagnale Jr. was.
The problem is we have so many Frank Abagnales in the homosexual community that they are now pulling off the greatest scam of our history. Using a hodgpodge of convoluted facts and twisted logic they have almost succeeded in portraying homosexuality as normal behavior. Good thing the real Frank Abagnale Jr. wasn't a larger gang all with equal talents.
It looks like the only hope we have in blocking gay marriage is via the physical sciences. Only by validating or offering a clear and present definition linking homosexuality to a physical disease or disorder can we legally object in the courts. If the theories and studies in genetics are strong and logical enough for the "real" scientists to recognize then gay marriage could get blocked. The key may be in simply defining the scientific studies on the subject "variations in nature" and demonstrate a valid claim that sexual behavior is not a normal variation. Of course the logic is if gay is a normal variation then all kinds of sex acts would equally be deemed as normal. By the gay understanding of variations molestation and rape is normal. It may be normal to see stories of rape on the news but that doesn't make it acceptable behavior. Do the right thing and don't be conned by homosexuals vote against gay marriage. Remember the 1973 vote to remove homosexuality from the list of mental disorders was done by members of the "soft" sciences, Psychiatry and Psychology aka the "opinionated" science and they changed their minds once so their kind of science changes with the tides of public opinion.
In Girl Scouts we camped, we rode horses, we fished, we did projects to help people, we planted flowers...etc. Not ONCE did the subject come up of whether anyone was gay or straight.
If you wanna learn to camp, go learn to camp.
If you wanna learn about sex, Scouts is not the place.
If you wanna to learn about God, go to church. If you wanna to learn about pederastic priests, go to church. Certain priests should be defrocked and certain scoutmasters kicked out. Unless nobody cares what role models our youth has....
I like that he's taking a stand on this issue so that ALL boys can participate in Boy Scouts if they wish to do so. The activities Boy Scout engage in have nothing to do with sexual orientation.
Oh c'omon, the boy scouts could use some really good interior decorators, My God have you ever been inside of one of those tents ? Dreadful I tell you,just greadful,not even a vase of fresh cut flowers, everything is this dismal drab green,HELLO did I say Boring? then they sit around a fire roasting marshmallos singing " On top of old Smoky" PHULEEZE, why cant they roast fois Gras on lemon grass sticks and belt out some great show stoppers like " Mame',and "How Lovly to be a Woman" ? Really I just don' know what the problem is here.
Liberals seem to think that private organizations should bend to accomodate their political opinions, I am inclined to just oppose every attempt to force issues. The comments in here are telling of the pervassivenes of the double minded hypocrisy of most liberals who can't understand why they are bigots (bigot, noun: a person is intolerant of any opinions but their own) when they attack Christians for disagreeing with them, and then justify themselves by claiming moral supremecy because they think they are tolerant and that tolerant trumps religious beliefs.
It is true that many Christians should try a lot harder to act like Jesus when it comes to how we interact with sinners (every one of us, saved or not by the way), but I find very strange that liberals feel so much rage, hatred and anger with people who disagree with them.
It is so sad to watch yet another group being hijacked because the intolerant, tolerance police, demand that everyone agrees with their opinions. It is the polar opposite of open mindedness in fact. A truth none that I know are willing to admit.
When priests or Boy Scout leaders "do it" with children of the same sex, in addition to being pedophiles, doesn't that also make them gay? So what's the problem, the churches and the boy scouts have been covering this stuff up for a long time now, why all the fuss? Wouldn't this make both cults more open and transparant.
In "To The Priests Our Lady's Beloved Sons" A Marian Movement of Priests publication, 1993 Supplement The Holy Mother speaks at Sant' Omero (Teramo) May 1, 1993 (She speaks to Reverand Stefano Gobbi) and The Mother of God said "Mortify Your Senses". I.E. Impose hardship on self to attempt to subdue the body of desire and passions by self-imposed disciplines, hardships, abstinence from pleasure. Colossians 3:5 "Put to death, therefore, whatever belongs to your earthly nature, sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed which is idolatry."NIV
It doesn't take much intelligence to understand that homosexuality is like bestiality, sodomy, incest, molestation, rape, polygamy, sexual slavery and many more of the unnatural, unacceptable, negative, and non-family orientated sex acts and promiscuity in general are all bad for humankind. AIDS/HIV, MRSA, HPV/Cancer, EIDS (Emerging Infectious Diseases), all the common Sexually transmitted diseases that are as we speak mutating and hybridizing into more deadly disease is cause and reason to refuse Gay Rights. Whatever it takes to protect the human race is necessary, invoke all sources to block gay rights and this New Advance of the Sexual Revolution. Forget your cousins and neighbors son or daughter is gay because to protect all humanity from the next coming plague will benefit more kids than any support of gay rights will. You saw how many died from AIDS and there are potentially millions of infectious diseases in other species of plants and animals that at anytime could like AIDS become a reality. Stop the insanity and stop gay rights. Mortify your sexual desires with discipline and self control and there will be less crime and a better world to live in.
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Listening to the Gay men I have know and know, boys figure out whether they are gay from age 5 on up (many in their teens and after). Many of them were in families which chose to discriminate against homosexuals and they suppressed their feelings (from news stories many are kicked out of their homes and some even commit suicide which is most unfortunate). No guy wants to be bullied, attached, killed, etc . so those who can suppress their feelings do suppress their feelings. The right wing media and right wing religions paint homosexually very negatively (also referring to all gays as effeminate which is totally wrong - most gays I know are not effeminate at all). So, gay boys suppressing their feelings are in the boy scouts now - and will continue to be in the scouts (it would be healthier if gay boys could be out otherwise all one is doing is protecting right wing Christian bigots from knowing they are around Gay boys, and to allow bigots (boys and adults) to continue to harass any boy they believe is gay).
Now a comment on whether homosexuality is genetic or not. First, let's get the difference between homosexuals and gays out and on the table. Homosexuals are any guy who has sex with other guys which can include totally straight guys who just want to have some fun. Gay guys are guys who are truly attracted to other guys and have the ability to (later) love guys (as a straight person would love a girl friend or wife). So, when one talks about gays, let's not confuse straight homosexuals who are not gay at all (maybe bi for sex) and Gay guys who are truly gay.
Next, let's understand how gay's are made (excluding straight guys having fun with other men). Common reasons presented are that it is genetic, god makes gays that way (remember, Christians' believe in a spirit and that spirit may be gay), some gays may be influenced to be gay, or some may be recruited. Let's dismiss the last two (influenced or recruited) because no guy would ever want to be referred to as gay after recognizing how gays are discriminated against, assaulted, killed, etc. - no guy would ever do this voluntarily. So, it is then genetic or the person's spirit as created by God. So far the studies of genetics are inconclusive but some studies have interesting findings (like I heard that in 70% of twins where 1 guy is gay the other is gay) and the fact that around 1.5% of the male population is said to be gay - which is not an insignificant number of people (noting most all are born by fathers and mothers who are straight). The other option is that a person's spirit is truly gay spirit created by God - I don't know of any group that has looked into this adequately (certainly the religions that insist on a literal transition would never come up with any adequate study to determine whether a spirit is truly straight, gay, or transgender). So - one is left with the fact that gay guys figure out that they are gay somehow (long and most likely painful process in most cases) and most all I have talked to say they were born that way (often after years of suppressing their feelings and trying to fit into the religious culture of their parents/church, even saying they chose to be this way when there was really no choice involved at all - the only choice they have is to try to be straight).
Comments given in some posts I've seen say that gays should be separated from straight campers (bathrooms, etc). This is totally laughable. Give all boys some credit and tell them they shouldn't play around and straight guys will not become gay (if gay - they are born that way).
You may want to read this article to enlighten yourself against our amoral secular public media and it's myths about homosexuality.
Three main studies are cited by "gay rights" activists in support of their argument—Hamer's X-chromosome research, LeVay's study of the hypothalamus, and Bailey and Pillard's study of identical twins who were homosexuals.
In all three cases, the researchers had a vested interest in obtaining a certain outcome because they were homosexuals themselves. More importantly, their studies did not stand up to scientific scrutiny by other researchers. Also, "the media typically do not explain the methodological flaws in these studies, and they typically oversimplify the results." There is no reliable evidence to date that homosexual behaviour is determined by a person's genes.
To the extent that biological or social factors may contribute to a person's bent toward homosexual behaviour, this does not excuse it. Some people have a strong bent towards stealing or abuse of alcohol, but they still choose to engage or not engage in this behaviour—the law rightly holds them accountable.
The final report of the BUWA task force states "that a person becomes a homosexual ultimately by choosing to be involved in same-sex activity . . . . This is in contrast to innate characteristics such as gender and ethnicity." The report affirms that "the Bible is clear that sin involves choice, and it unequivocally condemns homosexual behaviour as sin."
The charade of gay rights is reminiscent of the character Leonardo Di Caprio portrayed in the movie "Catch Me If You Can". On a toned down scale thousands of successful homosexuals have conned America into believing homosexuality is normal. They are the Anderson Coopers and Barney Franks of the world and all are capable of representing as regular guys and gals but underneath is a very sick mind, not much different than Frank Abagnale Jr. was.
The problem is we have so many Frank Abagnales in the homosexual community that they are now pulling off the greatest scam of our history. Using a hodgpodge of convoluted facts and twisted logic they have almost succeeded in portraying homosexuality as normal behavior. Good thing the real Frank Abagnale Jr. wasn't a larger gang all with equal talents.
It looks like the only hope we have in blocking gay marriage is via the physical sciences. Only by validating or offering a clear and present definition linking homosexuality to a physical disease or disorder can we legally object in the courts. If the theories and studies in genetics are strong and logical enough for the "real" scientists to recognize then gay marriage could get blocked. The key may be in simply defining the scientific studies on the subject "variations in nature" and demonstrate a valid claim that sexual behavior is not a normal variation. Of course the logic is if gay is a normal variation then all kinds of sex acts would equally be deemed as normal. By the gay understanding of variations molestation and rape is normal. It may be normal to see stories of rape on the news but that doesn't make it acceptable behavior. Do the right thing and don't be conned by homosexuals vote against gay marriage. Remember the 1973 vote to remove homosexuality from the list of mental disorders was done by members of the "soft" sciences, Psychiatry and Psychology aka the "opinionated" science and they changed their minds once so their kind of science changes with the tides of public opinion.
If you wanna learn to camp, go learn to camp.
If you wanna learn about sex, Scouts is not the place.
Really I just don' know what the problem is here.
It is true that many Christians should try a lot harder to act like Jesus when it comes to how we interact with sinners (every one of us, saved or not by the way), but I find very strange that liberals feel so much rage, hatred and anger with people who disagree with them.
It is so sad to watch yet another group being hijacked because the intolerant, tolerance police, demand that everyone agrees with their opinions. It is the polar opposite of open mindedness in fact. A truth none that I know are willing to admit.
In "To The Priests Our Lady's Beloved Sons" A Marian Movement of Priests publication, 1993 Supplement The Holy Mother speaks at Sant' Omero (Teramo) May 1, 1993 (She speaks to Reverand Stefano Gobbi) and The Mother of God said "Mortify Your Senses". I.E. Impose hardship on self to attempt to subdue the body of desire and passions by self-imposed disciplines, hardships, abstinence from pleasure. Colossians 3:5 "Put to death, therefore, whatever belongs to your earthly nature, sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed which is idolatry."NIV
It doesn't take much intelligence to understand that homosexuality is like bestiality, sodomy, incest, molestation, rape, polygamy, sexual slavery and many more of the unnatural, unacceptable, negative, and non-family orientated sex acts and promiscuity in general are all bad for humankind. AIDS/HIV, MRSA, HPV/Cancer, EIDS (Emerging Infectious Diseases), all the common Sexually transmitted diseases that are as we speak mutating and hybridizing into more deadly disease is cause and reason to refuse Gay Rights. Whatever it takes to protect the human race is necessary, invoke all sources to block gay rights and this New Advance of the Sexual Revolution. Forget your cousins and neighbors son or daughter is gay because to protect all humanity from the next coming plague will benefit more kids than any support of gay rights will. You saw how many died from AIDS and there are potentially millions of infectious diseases in other species of plants and animals that at anytime could like AIDS become a reality. Stop the insanity and stop gay rights. Mortify your sexual desires with discipline and self control and there will be less crime and a better world to live in.