and YES this is PUNITIVE and YES it will punish "innocent" students etc... that's the point; to remove the "sacrosanctity" of the sports programs and maybe, just maybe, put the emphasis back on EDUCATION at Penn State. The jocks can go somewhere else more ethical to get their four years free ride...
But you see that's just the point. NCAA has to do something for maximum impact, something that will affect institutional memory for many years to come. A penalty so awful, that no one at Penn State or ANY other institution would never ever think of doing this type of thing again. Death Penalty for 10 years for all sports at Penn State that charge admission to view. Being banned from ANY conference associated with the NCAA for that period of time! (THAT MEANS YOU "BIG TEN") That will get EVERYONE'S attention for sure!
Penn State should be banned from ALL NCAA sports for 5 years. This scandal was not confined to the football program, it permeated the very highest level of the university administration and the town government (police department) itself.
I agree 100% with your comment..I agree that Penn State should be out of a all NCAA sports for 5 years or more! This school has thumbed their nose at everyone and the administration people thought that no one would find out what they were ALL hiding...I think there will be more scandals to come out of this Sandusky issue. I myself wonder if Sandusky might have been the cause of some little boy who might be missing and only Sandusky knows where he is..If I were the cops I would start checking out any little boys who has disappeared in the Penn State area. The Perteno family should be barred from going on Penn State gounds and they certainly don't deserve special seating at any games in fact they show no remorse for what Joe did by hiding all of Sandusky child molestations.
The problem is not with the students, teachers, and alumni of Penn State. The problem or protential problem with all universitys happens because coaches and their staffs, administrators and their staffs and The Board of Trustees set up a culture that permits wrong doing for the sake of the SPORTS dollar.
The answer is simple, remove all members of the university who had or should have had a working knowledge of the Sandusky matter and did not do their job.
Let me say this about knowing what was going on with Sandusky. Every coach on the field and their staffs were talking about Sandusky in 1998. Every one of those men saw him with young boys at the complex.
The direct administration knew about this problem and should have had their informanys/security watching him at his OFFICE on Penn State property. The Board of Trustee had to know something was wrong when Paterno's replacement not only quit the program BUT was not hired by any other major university like the University of West Virginia. Something was wrong with Sandusky and someone told the other Universitys not to ask him for an interview.
By ousting the people who created the oppertunity for Sandusky, the message will be placed on the backs of the correct individuals and the message will be sent to the same group in every college in the land. That is fair.
What happened at Penn State were crimes and don't involve athletics at all, anyone who's smart knows the NCAA doesn't have jurisdiction over this and therefore cannot and should not punish any Penn State athletics. The men that committed these crimes will be punished.
The crimes of sexual abuse of kids were covered up to protect the sports program from bad publicity. It was for the sake of the sports program that the crimes were permitted to continue. It was for the sake of the sports program that young boys continued to be molested for years.
It is entirely appropriate that the sports program not escape unscathed from this.
The NCAA is a spline-less organization, focused on money. The SMU behavior is nothing compared to the PSU crime. PSU should be out of the football business for 10 years at least.
You clearly don't know what your talking about, just because a few men did some terrible things doesn't mean to go out of your way to punish every individual at Penn State.
zc2012, because Penn State went so far to cover up Sandusky's crimes -- simply to save face on their football program -- they should *lose* their football program.
Well KnowerseekerReturns if you have read anything on this topic you could easily understand that the reason the administration tried to cover it up was to try and protect the university. That is clearly wrong and for that they will all be punished. However the arguement your making would be like saying if this was professor then they should shut down all academics. Again the cover up was from the administration and because of their actions they will be punished. Now the best thing to do is to help the victims and their families move forward.
Well KnowerseekerReturns the arguement your making would suggest that if this was a professor then they should shut down all academics at the school. What this was, was a cover up by the administration. Their actions were wrong and for that they will be punished, now trying to hurt more people by shutting down football makes no sense. What needs to be done is for society to help the victims and their families move forward.
James Carvell made a good observation over the weekend. In an effort to punish a few old white guys (I paraphrase) the NCAA prposes to destry businesses and people who had absolutely nothing to do with Sandusky. Think about all the contracts, players, hotels, restaurants etc that will suffer by keeping Penn St out of football.
While punishment is often not a deterrent for the guilty, it can be a motivating factor for those who are not guilty but will suffer and help them make the choice to speak up. This is akin, to the military asking the entire unit to drop and give them 20 when one person makes a mistake--- if you know you'll be punished for what someone else does, you're more likely to help them do the right thing and warn them to not do the wrong thing.
If there is a consequence (as there should be) for the University's turning a blind eye (if that is what they did), then it is the University and its reputation that has damaged the players, the contracts, their students, etc. So the entire "team" or community suffers because one of its members made a mistake. A punishment is its due reward, and if you wish to encourage universities to pay attention it's in their reputation and in the fundraising (or lack thereof) that you will get their attention-- by paying attention to the demands of justice and delivering the fair punishment.
If you ignore the consequences (on behalf of the innocent who misplaced their trust in a corrupt school), you will end up doing more damage in the long run. If you consistently enforce egregious violations and teach people that they will get caught sooner or later-- eventually people will stop trying to game the system, and you will save more lives from being broken.
To punish a University of 38,000 sudents for the actions of 4 or 5 criminals is ludicrous to say the least and anyone supporting the "death penalty" or any such penalty against the football program are totally clueless.
Yes, Joe Paterno was involved in the cover-up conspiracy so shut down the football program. The players can transfer to other schools.
The AD, Tim Curly, was also involved, so it stands to reason that if they shut down football, then all sports should be eliminated at Penn State. The athletes can transfer to other schools.
Also, the President, Graham Spanier, and VP Gary Shultz were involved so it is probably a good idea to shutdown the entire university. The students can always transfer to other schools. As for the faculty and other employees, well I guess we have to expect some collateral damage.
In reality, destroying the football program would have serious university-wide repercussions. There would be less money for other athletic programs and what money these would receive could conceivably cause an increase in tuition and penalize future Pennsylvania college students.
With new leadership in place, and with a new board of trustees, I would hope that they can come up with something that would placate the rational and morons (unlikely) alike. Perhaps donating 20% of the profits received from football games for the next 5 years and 10% thereon to organizations that are involved with treating abused children, educating the public in recognizing the signs of child abuse and ultimately eliminating child abuse would be a good way to start.
TripNines, you have a point, and I can agree with you *if* the administrators are all fired and possibly charged in court. However, if that is not possible, then the next best way to hurt them is to hurt their precious football program.
If he only had an ounce of backbone....It would be shut down! But; this country is ruled by Athletics. Sports and money has become more important than "doing what it right."
I don't disagree, but the PSU scandal is just so egregious that it makes NCAA sports in general look bad. I think they'll do it to protect their own reputation and that of other schools.
Which isn't necessarily a bad thing. The program itself needs to be punished somehow, or the guys who were outed as covering it up will just get replaced by more soldiers who will do anything for the football machine and the guys who weren't outed (trustees) will giggle that they got away with it while rolling in bank.
If PSU is like most other major universities, if you shutdown the football program, you can kiss goodbye the funding for EVERY other sports program at PSU - except for probably mens basketball. Football provides funds for all of the other sports.
Or perhaps the NCAA can implement the death penalty on football, but require PSU to still sell tickets to (now non-existing) footbal games, in order to keep those funds coming in? Yeah, that's the answer!
so lesser, that means innocent male and female athletes should have to transfer to continue their athletic careers? What if they can't get a scholarship anywhere else?
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NCAA has to do something for maximum impact, something that will affect institutional memory for many years to come.
A penalty so awful, that no one at Penn State or ANY other institution would never ever think of doing this type of thing again.
Death Penalty for 10 years for all sports at Penn State that charge admission to view. Being banned from ANY conference associated with the NCAA for that period of time! (THAT MEANS YOU "BIG TEN") That will get EVERYONE'S attention for sure!
The answer is simple, remove all members of the university who had or should have had a working knowledge of the Sandusky matter and did not do their job.
Let me say this about knowing what was going on with Sandusky. Every coach on the field and their staffs were talking about Sandusky in 1998. Every one of those men saw him with young boys at the complex.
The direct administration knew about this problem and should have had their informanys/security watching him at his OFFICE on Penn State property.
The Board of Trustee had to know something was wrong when Paterno's replacement not only quit the program BUT was not hired by any other major university like the University of West Virginia. Something was wrong with Sandusky and someone told the other Universitys not to ask him for an interview.
By ousting the people who created the oppertunity for Sandusky, the message will be placed on the backs of the correct individuals and the message will be sent to the same group in every college in the land. That is fair.
It is entirely appropriate that the sports program not escape unscathed from this.
If there is a consequence (as there should be) for the University's turning a blind eye (if that is what they did), then it is the University and its reputation that has damaged the players, the contracts, their students, etc. So the entire "team" or community suffers because one of its members made a mistake. A punishment is its due reward, and if you wish to encourage universities to pay attention it's in their reputation and in the fundraising (or lack thereof) that you will get their attention-- by paying attention to the demands of justice and delivering the fair punishment.
If you ignore the consequences (on behalf of the innocent who misplaced their trust in a corrupt school), you will end up doing more damage in the long run. If you consistently enforce egregious violations and teach people that they will get caught sooner or later-- eventually people will stop trying to game the system, and you will save more lives from being broken.
Yes, Joe Paterno was involved in the cover-up conspiracy so shut down the football program. The players can transfer to other schools.
The AD, Tim Curly, was also involved, so it stands to reason that if they shut down football, then all sports should be eliminated at Penn State. The athletes can transfer to other schools.
Also, the President, Graham Spanier, and VP Gary Shultz were involved so it is probably a good idea to shutdown the entire university. The students can always transfer to other schools. As for the faculty and other employees, well I guess we have to expect some collateral damage.
In reality, destroying the football program would have serious university-wide repercussions. There would be less money for other athletic programs and what money these would receive could conceivably cause an increase in tuition and penalize future Pennsylvania college students.
With new leadership in place, and with a new board of trustees, I would hope that they can come up with something that would placate the rational and morons (unlikely) alike. Perhaps donating 20% of the profits received from football games for the next 5 years and 10% thereon to organizations that are involved with treating abused children, educating the public in recognizing the signs of child abuse and ultimately eliminating child abuse would be a good way to start.
Which isn't necessarily a bad thing. The program itself needs to be punished somehow, or the guys who were outed as covering it up will just get replaced by more soldiers who will do anything for the football machine and the guys who weren't outed (trustees) will giggle that they got away with it while rolling in bank.
Or perhaps the NCAA can implement the death penalty on football, but require PSU to still sell tickets to (now non-existing) footbal games, in order to keep those funds coming in? Yeah, that's the answer!