Comments on: Robert McNamara, Ex-Pentagon Chief, Dies
Served As Secretary Of Defense For Presidents Kennedy, Johnson During Vietnam War; Dies At 93
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- Hell is too good for him, GTR5.
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- "the only American war to end in abject withdrawal rather than victory. "
......that's not true, these colors ran in Korea, there was no victory there neither. In Beirut we also ran out after terrorists killed hundreds of marines. In Somalia we ran also ever short of victory. In Iraq we failed to find weapons of mass destruction, and now we leave a devastated country that celebrates us leaving and an insurgency we never really stopped. - Reply to this comment
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- Well, your summary is pretty accurate! Though, each is a unique situation with factors that must be analyzed specific to it!
Regarding the passage you quote, I think the author was speaking in terms of the overall lengthy nature of that war, the heavy manpower and material commitment to it, and the resulting failure to achieve the desired result---compared to some of the other wars you note in your
summary!
- Well, your summary is pretty accurate! Though, each is a unique situation with factors that must be analyzed specific to it!
- Bush, Cheney, Rice, Rumsfeld, Powell, and various others ought to go through this board and read EVERY posting! And, then realize that when
the end comes for them, they can expect the SAME kind of eulogy from
members of the public that they see here!
Because, FRANKLY---they have EARNED it through their misdeeds! And IF public criticism is the HIGHEST PENALTY any of these clowns have to pay for what they've done, then it's a dam cheap price, and they're getting off pretty easy! - Reply to this comment
- IT REALLY IS SO TRAGIC THAT SO MANY LIVES WERE LOST BECAUSE THEIR MISSION WAS POLITICAL AND UNCLEAR. SUCH WERE THE TIMES THEN.
WE ALSO HAD THE DRAFT WHICH MEANT THAT OUR YOUNG MEN COULD BE TAKEN INVOLUNTARY AND SENT TO DEATH OR A LIFETIME OF TRAUMA!!!
by HGOODGUY July 6, 2009 2:07 PM PDT
Yep, many of us lost good buddies and relatives in that tragic war called Vietnam.
That is....unless your name was AWOL George W. Bush, or five-time deferment Dick Cheney....and these two "brave" (snicker) men got to send another generation of brave young people to their possible death or physical and/or mental trauma....this time to an illegal war. You are right though, at least this time our young people were not drafted...they were just lied to. - Reply to this comment
- They better keep his burial place a secret because the lines to water his grave will be very long. He was a useless Know-it-all bookworm who killed a lot of America's best youth. He will be remembered as one of America's most hated citizens.
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- MAYBE THE LESSONS LEARNED IN VIET NAM, AS A RESULT OF MCNAMARAS FLAWED PERCEPTION, ARE THE REASON THAT OUR TROOPS ARE RESPECTED AND NEVER SENT ANYWHERE UNLESS THE MISSION IS CLEAR.
IT REALLY IS SO TRAGIC THAT SO MANY LIVES WERE LOST BECAUSE THEIR MISSION WAS POLITICAL AND UNCLEAR. SUCH WERE THE TIMES THEN.
WE ALSO HAD THE DRAFT WHICH MEANT THAT OUR YOUNG MEN COULD BE TAKEN INVOLUNTARY AND SENT TO DEATH OR A LIFETIME OF TRAUMA!!!
AT LEAST NOW MILITARY SERVICE IS VOLUNTARY AND, AS A RESULT, SOLDIERS KNOW WHAT THEY ARE BEING TRAINED FOR AND HELD IN HIGH ESTEEM.
MCNAMARA DIRECTED THE VIET NAM WAR ON "INTELECT AND THEORY" AND NEVER REALIZED THE HUMAN TOLL.
DEAD IS NOT THEORY--DEAD IS JUST DEAD!!!! - Reply to this comment
- The devil had to wait a long time for this bum.
He sent a lot of good,young men to their deaths,for no reason,and then had the balz to say it might have been a mistake.
My brother Pat,one of those good young men was killed in Nam in July 1966,and this worthless a$$wipe lives to be 93.
May Robert Strange McNamara rot in hell. - Reply to this comment
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- There are MILLIONS of Americans who can relate to what you are saying!
I'm sorry about your brother Pat, that's why these clowns need to be
held accountable for their actions! So, men like your brother aren't
needlessly killed! That's why Bush & Co. ought to be prosecuted for
what they've done regarding the Iraq War! For the good men & women
who were senselessly killed during this war, too!
- There are MILLIONS of Americans who can relate to what you are saying!
- The bean counter would not be missed by Vietnam Veterans. His policies were the main cause of the Vietnam debacle. Rumsfeld is his clone. Neither of them were qualified to serve as secretary of defense. They were put on board to save money, not win and wars. In both cases they grossly undersupplied the military actions resulting in unnecessary casualties. The basic principle of warfare is to hit the enemy with everything you can as soon as you can, not what these idiots were doing.
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- The bean counter would not be missed by Vietnam Veterans. His policies were the main cause of the Vietnam debacle. Rumsfeld is his clone. Neither of them were qualified to serve as secretary of defense. They were put on board to save money, not win and wars. In both cases they grossly undersupplied the military actions resulting in unnecessary casualties. The basic principle of warfare is to hit the enemy with everything you can as soon as you can, not what these idiots were doing.
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- America again lets a WAR criminal die of old age. This guy LIED as thousands of Americas soldiers died and were maimed. For sure his middle name STRANGE was a fitting description. Just like Rummy did for Cheney, Strange Mac did for the military industrial complex of that era. As long as America continues to let its leaders do very STUPID stuff with immunity from prosecution, it will loose brave soldiers obeying orders of STUPID GREEDY leaders. Now as Obama continues the Cheney crusades the people responsible for both the Afghan and Iraq debacle retire to write books like STRANGE MAC did, never fearing anyone from the government will ever bring charges of MURDER of innocents against them. What a shame that incompetence in politics is rewarded by a nice pension, book deals, public speaking for big money.
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- End of Story!
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- I remember McNamara as a "YES" man who was a "hawk" during the Vietnam War. He would go to South Vietnam and talk with that idiot General Westmoreland who ALWAYS wanted MORE and MORE and MORE; then McNamara would come home and demand that another 100,000 boys had to be drafted into the army so Westmoreland could have more "cannon fodder" to play with. If you had 2 arms, 2 legs, and 1/4 of a brain you got sent to Vietnam, PERIOD!
Everyone, from draft age kids to the relatives of those same kids, to returning Vietnam vets HATED McNamara and were all glad when LBJ finally let him go!
Since then, the hypocrite had been crying that he was "misunderstood" that he really hated the Vietnam War and was a critic of the war. He tried to convince everyone that he was just doing his job even though he had differences of opinion with LBJ.
Well, with all that blood on his hands, he can now try to convince a HIGHER POWER of that! No one here believed a word of it!!!
HAIL OBAMA??????? - Reply to this comment
- His death came 45 years too late.
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- Absolutely correct, McNamara was the prototypical statistician trying to quantify and predict battlefield victory by tracking data bits such as body counts among others. He may have been able to apply that sort of cold analysis to predict Ford's business performance but the intangible variables of combat escaped him. He was cold, he was analytical, and he was wrong........sounds like another far more recent SecDef as well.
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- His legacy will rightfully be as the "dispassionate architect of the Vietnam War".
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- Absolutely correct, McNamara was the prototypical statistician trying to quantify and predict battlefield victory by tracking data bits such as body counts among others. He may have been able to apply that sort of cold analysis to predict Ford's business performance but the intangible variables of combat escaped him. He was cold, he was analytical, and he was wrong........sounds like another far more recent SecDef as well.
- It was Robert McNamara, his failed tactics and his failure to support our troops, who made those sacrifices "useless." They didn't have to be. Dozens of books have been written about the "lessons of Vietnam," including McNamara's own. The lesson I'd like to remember is that we have a choice, we can make this generation's sacrifices in Iraq and Afghanistan "useless," or make them count. The way to make them "useless" would be to abandon the sacrifices already made, to fail to see this through. A Vietnam veteran.
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- The Cold War brought out the best and the worst in both nations. For many military persons, it was confusing to learn that one day they were in the best, and the next day, they were in the worst place they could be.
McNamara's service was considered honorable at the time and forced many dissidents in the USA to raise the conscience of the nation with protests for better priorities and better conflict resolution processes.
McNamara was part of a larger group that once had the majority in this nation. Many in that generation had counterparts in the Soviet Union who were equally tenacious and never backed down, until political leaders on both side started talking.
I do beleive that McNamara was good at his job, and that many Americans and Russians simply didn't like the task he had, and neither knew what they realy wanted. It was that dislike which fueled dissention and protests and took the country to a new direction. If he had been poor at his job, neither the USA or Soviet Union might have had enough time to decide what they really wanted.
The Cold War was a robotic fight without conscience that eventually resulted in both sides acquiring one. Many feel that it was more of a rebound war left over from unresolved issues in WWII.
Today, the NSA struggles for a valid mission. It was created to fight the cold war, and re-organized government serious enough to start the collection of Federal Income Taxes, but today, it lives the nightmare predicted by Eisenhaur of becoming the Defense Industrial Complex that dominates the priorities of the nation.
Robet McNamara was a good warrior, but had bad leaders to follow. - Reply to this comment
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- by pensacola8-2009 July 6, 2009 9:03 AM PDT
Robet McNamara was a good warrior, but had bad leaders to follow.
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You're usually more perceptive than your conclusion on Mr. McNamara shows!
Does a good warrior prevent the troops from winning by establishing 'rules of engagement'?
Does a good warrior risk the lives of the troops by trying to save a few dollars here and their---that is, 'fighting it cheap'?
Does a good warrior 'tell his boss what he wants to hear' when he knows it's not the truth? Does he do this for YEARS!?
Does a good warrior 'cut'n run'---quit his job because the stress of what he did is playing heavily upon his conscience?
Does a good warrior after supporting the war for years, say toward the end that it might be a 'mistake'---to begin the process of extricating himself---when he knew it WAS?
And, does a good warrior spend forty PLUS years alibiing, misstating, and spinning his own involvement in that war?!
The answer to these questions---my answer, is NO!
Robert McNamara was not a warrior, he was a successful auto exec, his
skill(s) were not transferable as Secretary of Defense, and consequently, he gave bad advice to his superiors regarding the war.
- by pensacola8-2009 July 6, 2009 9:03 AM PDT
- Was he a war crimminal, maybe. He certainly felt guilty enough about it. But he did come up with the idea for the Cuban missile blockade and he did save Ford in the fifties by green lighting the Falcon and the Mustang.
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- I was too young to remember much of the Vietnam War,but as I grew older I learned about Robert McNamara.Why he did what he did when he knew the war could never be won,we will never know.All I do know is that he died with the blood on his hands from more than 58,000 men and women who lost their lives and tens of thousands more soldiers who were wounded in a useless war.
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- It was Robert McNamara, his failed tactics and his failure to support our troops, who made those sacrifices "useless." They didn't have to be. Dozens of books have been written about the "lessons of Vietnam," including McNamara's own. The lesson I'd like to remember is that we have a choice, we can make this generation's sacrifices in Iraq and Afghanistan "useless," or make them count. The way to make them "useless" would be to abandon the sacrifices already made, to fail to see this through. A Vietnam veteran.
- To barberd3
The way to make the sacrifices in Iraq and Afghanistan count is to realize that they were not sacrifices for country, but sacrifices for multinational corporations who use them as a free mercenary service, and profiteers, who use the war budget as a source of corporate welfare.
Then bring them home, make those who sent them there pay, and use that realization to make sure such cannot happen again.
Otherwise the sacrifice is for nothing.
- jgjbcmi - You don't know squat, nuff said.
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