Comments on: Bush: "I'm The Decision Maker" On Iraq

President Challenges Congress Not To Condemn His Plan Before It's Had A Chance To Work

[grazinggoat]

They are also told to LIE to people in order to get them to convert to Islam and deceive people from the Truth.

Posted by singinrick

No better liar than the our hierarchic mother the Church, and it's some recent converts, Walking-LiarBush

[jimibear]

"grazinggoat, uuummm no, I'm not. The Islamists FORCE people to fight in the name of Allah and they FORCE people to convert or they kill them."

A lot like the history of Christianity. Spanish Inquisition, anyone?

"They have NO TOLERANCE for any other religion and they believe Islam is the only religion. I'm not just making this up. It's in the Quran! "

Haven't you just been saying that Christianity is the one true way? And it doesn't sound as if you're very tolerant of Muslims.

Not an attack; just a prod to your intellect. :-)

[idiotoclast]

Try talking to some Muslims about what they think of the extremists. They hate them more than we do, because they end up getting tarred with the same brush.
Posted by jimibear

Very true!

[jimibear]

"Now, back to the point. This is a religious war we are in right now. Islamic-Facist against Israel and the "Christian" West. These facist do not care about death... This is why we have to grant them their wish... to die as a martyr for their believes. That is why I stand behind our troops at this time!
Posted by Idiotoclast at 05:28 PM : Jan 26, 2007

Back to the original topic... any comments?
Posted by Idiotoclast at 05:38 PM : Jan 26, 2007
+ report this comment"

Both true and untrue. A certain small segment of Muslims are using a perversion of their faith to justify killing. Most of the people fighting US forces in Iraq, though, are fighting a foreign force who invaded their country, and don't want to die any more than any other human.

Try talking to some Muslims about what they think of the extremists. They hate them more than we do, because they end up getting tarred with the same brush.

[idiotoclast]

"The Quran teaches intolerance to all who oppose Islam."

Actually, Islamic teaching before Muhammed (600's AD)was very peaceful. Wars between the Jews and Muslims is what caused Muhammed to "prophecy" hatred for the infidels.

In the old testament, Jews also were taught to take their promised land by force... it isn't until the arrival of Jesus that Love was preached.

[huskerarmy]

singinrick, don't throw your pearls before swine... only revelation will help these morons..
Posted by Idiotoclast at 04:48 PM : Jan 26, 2007

[grazinggoat]

Idiotoclast,
I'll try my best but this is quite impossible to behave with such people and SickRick on board.

[idiotoclast]

Yes... I believe the insurgency is religion/power based... However, from the U.S. side, it is a war to bring a somewhat Americanized democracy to the region for other purposes...

[idiotoclast]

grazinggoat... please make your point without the personal attacks... geez...

[grazinggoat]

I have to admit you are not on purpose though, you bring some people to get interested into this subject that is out, passed way long ago.

You succeed to divide the intelligent who criticises you and old stories told uniquely in order to divide people and segment them into ''Believers and non-Bleivers''. This is an abject job of division you are doing. You don't realise that you are playing the same idiot game of the Islamists who succeed in dividing and dragging the idiots into their ranks, in order to fight the Infidels that are ignorant people such as you.

What makes you different from them, hey idiot? You are as mean as they are and as cretinily as they can be.

You're just blinded by a hatred that lives in you. And falling into the same error many generations did before your intelligence came to this world. Crusades and countre-crusades have let a lot fo people into their blood for insignificant differences between the faithful groups.

[idiotoclast]

If you think we're in Iraq (or they're fighting us) because of religion, you're fooling yourself.
Posted by r_bayless at 05:43 PM : Jan 26, 2007

So... are you saying Bin Laden is in it for the money?

[jimibear]

"-jimibear, isn't everything in life about faith??

Think about that. You can either put your faith in God's word or you can put your faith in what the world says and what science says. Either way there's no way to prove either side, except by having faith."

To a point, I agree. But there are empirical tests of scientific theory. Certain things can be shown to exist.

I don't deny God's existence, because to my mind I have no proof either way. I assume there must have been a Creator of some sort, because the universe didn't just appear one day. But I don't believe we (as humans) are really capable of understanding that Being, and I don't believe any one religion has a monopoly on the truth.

[jimibear]

"jimibear, us Christians believe that Jesus IS God...that He and the Father are "ONE" as he clearly tells us in the Bible. Therefore, Muslims DO NOT believe in the same God. This is why their quran calls anyone who believe in the Holy Trinity (The father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit) a pagan."

Ok, I see what you mean. They disagree with the divinity of Jesus. It seems to me, though, that God would really like us all to get along; I can't imagine He created us to kill each other.

I think that's part of why people get offended when someone brings up God; it's the mention of a religious war in the same breath that is offensive.

I don't hate Muslims for their beliefs, and the Muslims I have spoken to, here and overseas, are (if anything) more tolerant of Christians than vice versa. yes, there are extremist loonies on both sides.

But if we're going to have a war, can't we just leave God out of it? Just admit that it is for money, power, oil, land, whatever. There is NO such thing as a "holy war"; it's an oxymoron. Can you seriously believe that a father would take sides if his children were trying to kill each other?

He wants us to stop. All of us.

[idiotoclast]

Now, back to the point. This is a religious war we are in right now. Islamic-Facist against Israel and the "Christian" West. These facist do not care about death... This is why we have to grant them their wish... to die as a martyr for their believes. That is why I stand behind our troops at this time!
Posted by Idiotoclast at 05:28 PM : Jan 26, 2007

Back to the original topic... any comments?

[grazinggoat]

-Muslims do not believe in the same God that Christians do.

Muslims deny the Holy Trinity, they deny the crucifiction of Christ, and they call anyone who believes Jesus was born of Mary a pagan.

It's all in their Quran
Posted by singinrick

SickRick you are spreding some idiot spews again. You know nothing about Islam. So stop your cretinism on this blog.

[jn122736]

%u201CWhat makes you believe we just popped out of nowhere for no reason in the first place from an unintelligent piece of pond scum?%u201D

It's faith jn122736. You have faith in Science and evolution, and I have faith in God and His creation.
Posted by singinrick at 05:03 PM : Jan 26, 2007
--------

The inference here seems to be that we had to come from somewhere therefore you believe we had to have been created by God. Could you then, using the same logic, please explain where god came from?

[jimibear]

"-Muslims do not believe in the same God that Christians do."

Actually, they say they do. It's Christians who say they don't. "Allah" just means "God", and the Muslims believe our God and theirs are one and the same. They just don't believe Jesus was the Son of God, although they acknowledge Him as a great prophet.

[jimibear]

Rick, this is a question which I have always wondered about.

"If man can come up with fabulous inventions and modern marvels, couldn't he have created the idea of God?

Posted by huskerarmy at 05:17 PM : Jan 26, 2007

-God was here long before man huskerarmy."

How do we know that? No one has seen or spoken to God, and obviously we weren't here before we were here to check if he was around then. So all we have is words written by men to go on.

Is the answer just "faith" ... and if so, isn't that just a little specious; "You have to believe because there's nothing else to go on"?

It offends my rational mind a bit, honestly.

[idiotoclast]

singinrick, I applaud your sincerity and faith. I too believe in God, and have a personal relationship with Jesus. However, the discussion on this board has to do with Iraq, President Bush, etc. My comment is historically true. The foundation of Islam originates in Abraham's son, Ishmael, who he had with one of his concubines. His faith wavered on his promise to be the father of many nations. He later has Isaac with his true wife and Judaism has its beginning there. From there, Judaism and Islam split. Mohammed rewrote the meaning of Islam... and the Jews went the way of the Law.

Now, back to the point. This is a religious war we are in right now. Islamic-Facist against Israel and the "Christian" West. These facist do not care about death... This is why we have to grant them their wish... to die as a martyr for their believes. That is why I stand behind our troops at this time!

[huskerarmy]

"It is man's sin and denial of God that has conflicted the hearts of human beings throughout history."

Rick, I've witnessed as preacher after preacher has fallen from grace for sins far greater then I. In fact, God has been used to obfuscate and excuse all matter of tyrany and injustice. I'm afraid sin and man's denial of God have no correlation.