Comments on: 4th JFK Terror Suspect Surrenders

Guyanese Suspect In NYC Terror Plot Turns Himself In To Police In Trinidad

[notblue]

j-whitman, I love the cigarette thing, too funny! Please tell us what high explosives do to jet fuel?? What a moron you are, hello! the fireball could be seen from very far away and many lives would be lost along with a terrible disruption to the airline industry, wake up and smell the jet fuel so to speak. What if any signififcance does your cigarette thing have????

[j-whitman]

notblue,, No doubt terrorism is a major threat, but even more of a threat is this administration blowing it out of proportion & lying to Americans about it ---- You can put a ciggerette out in JP5, most of the fuel piping at JFK is under ground..

[radiob-2009]

Perhaps you missed this Jimibear and it is from wikipedia


JET A-1
Flash point: 38 0C
Autoignition temperature: 210 0C
Freezing point: -47 0C (-40 0C for JET A)
Open air burning temperatures: 260-315 0C (500-599 0F)
Maximum burning temperature: 980 0C (1796 0F)
Density at 15 0C (60 0F): 0.775-0.840


Read this Jimibear

http://www.engr.psu.edu/ae/WTC/MannyHerraResponse.htm

[notblue]

Jimibear, you also only respond to parts of my statements, again, if you were to actually recognize and legitimize the threat of terrorism what validity would your opinions have? From my perspective NONE.

[jimibear]

Yes, notblue, I did attack your spelling skills - please, however, note my earlier post (which you conveniently ignored). Attacking your spelling was not "all I had"; it was simply all I had which you felt you could respond to.

[jimibear]

Sorry, radiob - suggesting you might be lying was rude. I maintain you are wrong, though: the melting point of steel you cite is incorrect.

And, I see, so is mine - I meant 2,750 F, not 27,500 - oops! But in any case - the hottest temp aviation fuel can reach is still about 400 degrees Celsius below the melting point of steel.

There were actual pools of re-solidified molten metal at ground zero. If a fire manages to overcome the heat resistant properties of steel, raising that steels temperature to 2,800 degrees Fahrenheit, the steel will melt. If the fire fails to raise the steel's temperature to 2,800 degrees Fahrenheit, the steel will not melt. (Keep in mind, we're not talking about the temperature at which steel weakens and loses its structural integrity, we're talking about the temperature at which it is reduced to a molten state.)

Again, we call on common sense to answer a simple question: Under what circumstances can temperatures less than 2,800 degrees Fahrenheit reduce steel to a molten state? The answer is: Under no circumstances.




To date, nobody has suggested the fires on 9/11 reached temperatures of 2,800 degrees Fahrenheit. Perhaps that is because, just as steel has a maximum temperature it can withstand before it melts, fuel sources have a maximum temperature at which they can burn. NONE of the known fuel sources burning on 9/11 could have reached the required temperature to melt steel.

[radiob-2009]

The old saying "there's one born every minute" comes to mind.Have any of these conspiracy theorist ever worked with explosives, steel(in the molding & shaping process) ever been inside a fire and witnessed all of the other elements that ignite and explode? Perhaps they need to pay a visit to ARMCO and watch the process or DOW chemical and see how volatile these ingredients are.

[notblue]

jimibear, what a hoot, I have a real job and only have a few seconds to type my comments so you will have to put up with the spelling and the rest. It's greta when all you got is a diatribe on my typing and spelling skills. HA!HA!HA!

[notblue]

Aviation fuel burns violently and hot , it does not have to be under pressure. I have been through a course on crash fire rescue at the Minneapolis/St.Paul International airport, they have a partial fuselage in a diked pool of jet fuel they ignite. We used light water foam to smother the fire. Even after almost totally extinguishing the fire it can move around the foam film and reignite. To say Jet fuel is not dangerous shows the extent of illusion and lies you people are willing to go to minimize this attempt at terror. Not only did we NEED the silver suites but two mobile water cannons were on hand just in case. The heat was intense!

[golfkt]

The steel doesn't need to burn...The steel just needs to be weakened. The primary structural components were damaged/destroyed. The crash left too much additional load on the remaining columns. If you understood how the trade center was constructed, the conspiracy theoristes would stop their nonsense. The outer shell was also part of the load bearing process and that was severely damaged.

[jimibear]

"This is an example of how the real war on terror should be fought, ie as a police action involving the intelligence services. These threats are real enough and should be taken seriously, as they are elsewhere, but involving the entire military is a waste of their mission, which is to protect America against threats to America, not merely to a small fraction of her citizens. Your chance of dying in a terror attack is 1 in 1300, and THAT is if a 9-11 attack occured every year. Your chance of dying in a car accident is 1 in 83.
Posted by ubrew12 at 04:10 PM : Jun 05, 2007"

Thank you, ubrew. Exactly on the money.

Another thing the NeoCons refuse to realize is that Bush's method of fighting terror not only doesn't work, but actually makes the problem far worse by breeding hatred throughout the world. Fighting terror as a law enforcement action is the only effective method, as shown by these arrests.

[jimibear]

Also, notblue, when quoting from posts of mine, could you please try to avoid inserting spelling errors? It risks making me look as if (like you) I don't know the difference between "your" and "you're".

I think even you should be able to handle a copy and paste, but just ask for instructions if you need them.

I promise to try to keep it simple, as you are clearly a child who got left behind.

[radiob-2009]

jimibear

Not lying the temperatures are from wikipedia.

[jimibear]

""Your either against Bush or your a moron" Nice Jimibear, truly exemplifies your simplisitic thought process and helps one understand your ignorant perspectives. Here we have situation where terrorists were foiled from carrying out a plan that could have led to great loss of life and terrible disruptions of the airline transportation industry and what was your response? Typical, just make light of the whole thing as to reduce it's importance and attempt to make it irrelevent the leftwing pascifist way. If one was to actually take the threat of radical Islam seriously then your views would suddenly not be relevant.
Posted by notblue at 03:07 PM : Jun 05, 2007:"

Idiot: it was very clear that I was making a point that people who support Bush lack the ability to process complex ideas and think beyond sound bites. That is why I used a para-phrasing of Bush's own moronic statement to make that point.

The fact that you didn't get that is simply further proof that you truly do have to be stupid to support George Bush.

I will offer you some advice which you desperately need: It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and prove it.

I haven't made light of this attempted terrorist attack, so the rest of your post is just more of your usual meaningless babble.

[ubrew12]

This is an example of how the real war on terror should be fought, ie as a police action involving the intelligence services. These threats are real enough and should be taken seriously, as they are elsewhere, but involving the entire military is a waste of their mission, which is to protect America against threats to America, not merely to a small fraction of her citizens. Your chance of dying in a terror attack is 1 in 1300, and THAT is if a 9-11 attack occured every year. Your chance of dying in a car accident is 1 in 83.

[jimibear]

"I am with you 100 % notblue this jimbear has to be the most ignorant guy i have heard in long time i am not for Bush on every thing but i am not against him either so i guess i am a moron sccording to jimbear if people was in charge like jim usa and the world would be in bad shape the world is full of terrorist
Posted by dfazio21 at 04:03 PM : Jun 05, 2007"

All you to do is look at your pathetic command of the language to see which of us is more knowledgable, dfazio21.

It's not just according to me that you're a moron. The fact that you don't know what I am talking about means that you, not I, are ignorant.

The world may indeed be full of terrorists. Unfortunately, the worst of them is in the White House.

[jimibear]

Radiob, I am not sure if you are lying, or just wrong, but in any case:

maximum burning temp of aviation fuel (as you state): 980C

And bear in mind that the only way to achieve that high of a temp is for the fuel to be under pressure and under constant ignition (as when in an engine). Open air burn temps are lower.

HOWEVER:

Steel is just the element iron that has been processed to control the amount of carbon. Iron, out of the ground, melts at around 1510 degrees C (27500F). Steel melts at around 1370 degrees C (25000F).

So, it is in fact not possible for burning aviation fuel to have melted the support beams in the Twin Towers as the government claims.

[dfazio21]

I am with you 100 % notblue this jimbear has to be the most ignorant guy i have heard in long time i am not for Bush on every thing but i am not against him either so i guess i am a moron sccording to jimbear if people was in charge like jim usa and the world would be in bad shape the world is full of terrorist

[jimibear]

"As in your own post where you stated that Bush did not even read his own father book on the Gulf War and Bush own claims of not being a reader, how could he be knowledgeable enough to pull off 9-11?
Posted by radiob at 03:45 PM : Jun 05, 2007
+ report abuse"

If 9-11 was an inside job, it was (of course) not done by one man alone.

If (and it is indeed an if) 9-11 was orchestrated by the gov't, Bush had help.

Bush is evil and stupid. Those around him are just evil. Cheney & his pals could pull off a 9-11 without a problem.

[draugwolf]

there was no danger from these idiots..aviation fuel won't explode unless it's pressurized...(which it is not when stored in tanks) thats why last year when Israel bombed Beirut"s airport the tanks did't explode..LOL don't believe the lies from the panicky right wing press..America...a nation of nine year olds ..P.S. notblue if your so worried about radical Islam why arent you over in Iraq driving over a bomb for our freedom .. LOL dont worry your kids can do it in a few years for ya....we should have stayed in Afganistan and prolly invaded Pakistan and all of this would be OVER