Comments on: Jesus Documentary Stirs Heated Debate

Scholars Dismiss Film's Claim That Jesus' Remains Were Found In Jerusalem Tomb

[his_forever]

[1] First Doctrine:
The first thing you perceive, if you stand by his empty tomb, is HIS DIVINITY. The dead in Christ shall rise first at the resurrection: but he who rose first%u2014their leader, rose in a different fashion. They rise by imparted power. He rose by his own. He could not slumber in the grave, because he was God. Death had no more dominion over him. There is no better proof of Christ%u2019s divinity that that startling resurrection of his, when he rose from the grave, by the glory of the Father. O Christian, thy Jesus is a God; his broad shoulders that hold thee up are indeed divine; and here thou hast the best proof of it%u2014because he rose from the grave.

[his_forever]

According to Spurgeon the doctrines we may learn from this grave. %u201CCome, see the place where the Lord lay.%u201D with solemn awe for you and I will have to lie there too.

%u201CHark! from the tomb a doleful sound,

Mine ears, attend the cry,

Ye living men, come view the ground

Where ye must shortly lie.%u201D

%u201CPrinces, this clay must be your bed,

In spite of all your powers.

The tall, the wise, the reverend head,

Must lie as low as ours.%u201D

[joseph8819]

it also seems funny that people are posting the same thing k we all know whats been said the point is if u think the bible is true then good do that if not thats fine two who cares seems to me religion has become more of a death sentence look at how many wars over human history have been fought over it couldn't it be that there all the same i mean they all serve the same purpose a reason for being a reason to love and be the best person u can be and who cares if this is all lies the truth will always come through

[joseph8819]

i don't think it matters if god or Jesus were alive its whats behind the teachings and even if Jesus did live at one point what does it matter if you've found his remains the point is he would have been a better people then seems possable i look at the bible as more of a hand book to lead people through life and it may warn us of what will happen if we don't be kind to one another and if he is the grater being i don't think he would care much to know what where doing or to come back here couldn't blame him for not wanting to if i were him i wouldn't

[jabberwock11]

Wow! you guys are still arguing about this. I figured everyone would be burned out on this by now. But I guess I was wrong. Well ...... argue on.

[gaye5]

When it all boil down to it we can all say that there is no proof in so many things because???
I can come up with all sorts of thing just as you can, and it gets us no where.. It does not concern me as to what you believe or dont believe, and just like you, many of the religious people on here put me off also, so there is no way that I am going to continue to port what I believe as it gains us nothing, our lives are very short and I dont even care if I am right or wrong as when I die for me it wont matter...

[gaye5]

jwhiteTenn, I can understand your disbelief, as I also did once... Nothing on this earth was going to make me belive in this stuff, but being a nurse I spoke to many who were dying....
you say, most scholors believe he got his info about jesus through the christians of that day. that really makes it hearsay in my book.
That also is hearsay, I have never heard this before from what I have read he was a known historian at the time and was not a believer so why would he listen to Christians... and wasn't it Georgeos Diaz-Montexano who wrote about the Pillars of Hercules..

[jwhitetenn]

"The mere existence of someone in history is (often) easily established on the basis of small textual samples (sometimes even single paragraphs). The amount of data (especially historically 'incidental') we have about Jesus in the New Testament--and the appearances that the authors were not collusive--gives us a very, very high level of assurance in this matter"

Posted by Gaye5 at 05:45 PM : Feb 28, 2007

so we could substitute spiderman for jesus in the new testament and that would prove that spiderman existed 2000 years ago.

[jwhitetenn]

jocephus work was called antiquities of the jews and is accepted as written in the 2nd half of the first century. that paragraph is called the tesamonium flavianum. there is still debate on whether later christians inserted the entire paragragh or just embellished a simple sentence.
in his words jocephus says "He was the Messiah. When Pilate, upon hearing him accused by men of the highest standing amongst us, had condemned him to be crucified, those who had in the first place come to love him did not give up their affection for him. On the third day he appeared to them restored to life, for the prophets of God had prophesied these and countless other marvellous things about him."
not very jewish of him is it.

[jwhitetenn]

yeah ive read the jocephus thing,
did you know that there were copies of that work that were older than the one with that paragraph that did not contain those words?
and what about hercules?

[jwhitetenn]

I mean, ok
he was a carpenter (jesus)
is there any record of what he built? any artifacts?
anything written that dates back to the not just the first century, but the specific accepted time when jesus roamed the earth? writings by him? a picture someone might have drawn of him? a childhood home?
proof that nazereth was actually a village or town at that time?
2000 years is a long time, dont get me wrong, but we have more evidence and specifics for things much older and much less important that these events.

[gaye5]

The Historian writer Josephus who was not a believer and who lived at the time of Jesus, also says in his work on the institutions of the Jews: In these times there was a wise man named Jesus, if it is fitting for us to call him a man. For he was a worker of glorious deeds and a teacher of truth. Many from among the Jews and the nations became his disciples. He was thought to be the messiah, but not according to the testimony of the principal [men] of [our] nation. Because of this, Pilate condemned him to the cross and he died. For those who had loved him did not cease to love him. He appeared to them alive after three days. For the prophets of God had spoken with regard to him of such marvelous things [as these]. And the people of the Christians, named after him, has not disappeared till [this] day.

[jwhitetenn]

oh, ok
but the jocephus thing, i've read this. its a small paragraph written i think sometime after 70 a.d, i could be wrong. yeah most scholors believe he got his info about jesus through the christians of that day. that really makes it hearsay in my book.
he also wrote an awful lot about the stories of hercules. do you believe in hercules because jocephus wrote about him?

[gaye5]

jwhiteTenn, Jesus did exist, even the historian Josephus who lived in Jesus time, wrote of him..
From a historiography standpoint, this is mostly an 'academic' exercise, since the 'existence' of Jesus of Nazareth could easily be established with only a tiny fraction of our New Testament documents. The mere existence of someone in history is (often) easily established on the basis of small textual samples (sometimes even single paragraphs). The amount of data (especially historically 'incidental') we have about Jesus in the New Testament--and the appearances that the authors were not collusive--gives us a very, very high level of assurance in this matter.

Again, professional and academic scholars of the period -- Christian, Jewish, Secular -- accept the New Testament as an adequate witness, both for historical 'existence' and for many pieces of historical detail about Jesus.

[jwhitetenn]

"Biblical prophcies are exact, eg, it says that Jesus will be sold for 7 peices of silver which will be used to buy a potters field.."

Posted by Gaye5 at 05:35 PM : Feb 28, 2007

is this a prophecy from the old testament that was fufilled in the new?
if so, that doesnt hold much water for me, as I believe the bible is a work of fiction, the new testament extended from the old.

[jwhitetenn]

so the bible said that after ww2 is over that the english will give israel back to the jews?

[gaye5]

jwhiteTenn, Biblical prophcies are exact, eg, it says that Jesus will be sold for 7 peices of silver which will be used to buy a potters field.. now if you were wanting something to fit something you would not be that exact,, there are 5 prophcies in just these few words. There have been many prophets thoughtout history and the test for a real prophet is if he gets it all right, which in some cases is very fortunate for him as they are often way in the future..
Unfortunately nostradomas's prophicies can mean all sorts of things, we were suposed to have had something large come and either hit the earth or something in 1998...it didnt happen..the mayan calander says that the end of the world is in the year 2012..

[jwhitetenn]

well, here is my position.
I dont believe the bible is true. I have thought about it a lot and have come to that conclusion on my own. as a matter of fact I am borderline on whether or not jesus even existed. due to the lack of contemporary evidence.
I do , however, believe in god.
the proof of god is that there are things, everywhere. I believe god is an energy and is guiding the other forces of the universe, stirring the pot, if you will.
I dont believe god cares if you curse, cheat on your taxes, or even kill another person. I believe people care about that, and so in order to stop that kind of behavior we developed a system of morality and a leader to follow that should not be questioned by the believers.
I've gone to church since I was 1 or 2 and as long as I can remember being there The story didn't make sense. I did however, benefit from the teaching, its why i act the way i do sometimes. there are good teachings about compassion and what not. I just never have believed the story of jesus.
also, these quotes some christians throw out, are they from the king james version of the bible? cause there are real problems with that version.
did you know that there are 4,000 differences between the king james version of the bible and the oldest known translation we have today?

[jwhitetenn]

well, here is my position.
I dont believe the bible is true. I have thought about it a lot and have come to that conclusion on my own. as a matter of fact I am borderline on whether or not jesus even existed. due to the lack of contemporary evidence.
I do , however, believe in god.
the proof of god is that there are things, everywhere. I believe god is an energy and is guiding the other forces of the universe, stirring the pot, if you will.
I dont believe god cares if you curse, cheat on your taxes, or even kill another person. I believe people care about that, and so in order to stop that kind of behavior we developed a system of morality and a leader to follow that should not be questioned by the believers.
I've gone to church since I was 1 or 2 and as long as I can remember being there The story didn't make sense. I did however, benefit from the teaching, its why i act the way i do sometimes. there are good teachings about compassion and what not. I just never have believed the story of jesus.
also, these quotes some christians throw out, are they from the king james version of the bible? cause there are real problems with that version.
did you know that there are 4,000 differences between the king james version of the bible and the oldest known translation we have today?

[gaye5]

justinclssn, your argument doesnt hold water.. speaking in tongues is also done by other religions, even spiritualists..
and all that you say here is just exactly what
RandalDS is talking about, and although I believe that Jesus was whom he said he was and I am born again, RandalDs is so right, we will get all the usual number if insane religious people sprouting a lot of nothing, and turning even me off...
Justinclssn, I dont believe that what they have found could be the Jesus we know, but lets not turn the whole world off by our religious jargan...it means nothing to them and sprouting a whole lot of mumbo jumbo here will not help anyone..and what you say does not prove Jesus is real... people have caused blood to come out of their bodies through just believing that they can and more..
Justin, we dont have to prove anything, if we are wrong we have nothing to loose, and if they are wrong they will find out to late..