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shierp says:
by variablespanner August 6, 2010 5:39 PM EDT
Please explain how your perversion of the law would address a person born with both sets of sexual organs -- they do exist. In theory based on your statements they are in a catch 22 -- because their relationship with anyone else by definition would be both homosexual and heterosexual -- unless you intend to invade their privacy to find out exactly how they chose to express their intimacy.
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I guess that they could whatever they wish. What would I care. It does beg questions of logistics and placement and technique. I don't think that they could marry themselves though since they are one person. If they get themselves pregnant, can they be arrested for incest?
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slow-news-day replies:
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You keep saying you are arguing facts, perish. How about getting around to them?
shierp replies:
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There doesn't have to be a governmental need. If the people vote, and it violates no rights, the will of the people should be upheld.
david4673 replies:
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It did violate rights shierp.


What about that fact are you unclear on?

The people can not vote on basic rights. These are outlined in the document that gave the people the right (basic right) to vote -- the US Constitution.


Are you saying we can vote to "stop voting".

Your premise is wrong. You should really give it up, these other posters have you beat by a mile on facts and legal precedence.
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shierp says:
Homosexuals are not denied any rights that are not also denied heterosexuals. In Lawrence V Texas it was found that the state's sodomy laws violated the 14th amendment because they applied only to homosexual acts. The law had to apply to all equally. The California law preventing marriage among same sex couples does not discriminate against anyone. It is equal to all.
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shierp replies:
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The California law does not discriminate and does not violate the 14th amendment because it applies equally regardless of sexual orienation.
What is this"lies" nonsense? When you folks run out of intelligent arument, you just have to start the insults, don't you.
shierp replies:
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variablespanner..

I'm with you buddy. I'm just telling the reasons that I think it could be overturned on appeal. Not to mention that it was ruled on by a openly gay judge in San Francisco. There will be questions of bias.
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slow-news-day says:
Perish - why not admit that it's really your religious beliefs which make you uncomfortable with homosexuals getting married?

That's the truth, isn't it?


.
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shierp replies:
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I am for gay marriage. You think that because I argue facts of a case that I am some sort of bible thumper?
slow-news-day replies:
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I think it's precisely that you aren't arguing facts that makes you a bible thumper.
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shierp says:
Since the federal law does not recognize gay rights, does California law? One of the ways to overturn a law enacted by popular vote would be for it not to meet constitutional muster. Since it is a state law, it is subject to the state constitution. Why hasn't the state recognized gay rights? Why do the proponents of gay rights try to go through the court instead of getting a movement started to give sexual orientation "rights" status? When was the last time any of you signed that petition?
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shierp says:
by slow-news-day August 6, 2010 4:17 PM EDT
Well, basically, perish, it's because you're willing to throw reason and the Constitution out of the window in favor of it.
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The constitution protects people on the basis of race, creed, color, ethnicity, sex, and national origin. Some people have tried to assert that "sex" means sexual orientation but the supreme court has said no. There does not exist such a thing as gay rights legally in the U.S. Not supporting anything based on "gay rights" does not mean you are being unconstitutional.
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slow-news-day replies:
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Perhaps not, but discrimination is illegal.

You are not going to change my mind on this. I don't see you with one foot to stand on.
slow-news-day replies:
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LGM, I'm pretty sure he found it on a side of box of Constitution-O's...
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noloyalisti says:
Great job:

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
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shierp replies:
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No person may marry another person of the same gender under the law. Equality is therefore achieved. There is no discrimination.
slow-news-day replies:
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Depends which state you are speaking of.

If you think there's equality, you're high.
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shierp says:
I will write this for the thousandth time. In the country of the United States of America, there is no constitutionally recognized right of sexual orientation. There has been no law from the legislature to make it so. There has been signature of the president to make it a law. The supreme court has not ruled that sexual orientation is a right in any case. they have not even gone as far as to give it "suspect" status, which would make it an unofficial right.
There is no such thing as "gay rights" legally recognized in the USA. You cannot discriminate against that which does not exist. I'm just telling how it is. Write your congressman if you don't like the truth.
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slow-news-day replies:
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Doesn't need to be, any more than there needs to be a right to be black, or handicapped, or an orphan.

Sorry, but that's a very weak argument which holds no water.
shierp replies:
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But it is the truth. The constitution says race and the law had to be enacted to provide for the handicapped. I don't get your "orphan" tjing. There has been no law or ruling that makes being gay a right. Sorry if that hurts you, somehow.
slow-news-day replies:
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Doesn't hurt me that you're wrong about discrimination in the least.
shierp replies:
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I haven't said whether I believe it is right or wrong. I am only telling you the legal status of sexual orientation and why there has been no unequal protection.
slow-news-day replies:
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And I'm telling you you are incorrect.
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noloyalisti says:
shierp Honestly, who are you or anyone else to determine that gays don't have equal rights. I suppose for you, blacks, Muslims. Mexican immigrants, etc. also don't have the same rights.
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shierp replies:
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Race, ethnicity, and national origin are protected by the constitution. Why do you people always start slinging mud when you don't agree with something?
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janet5695 says:
Let Gay`s marry and live their lives the way they think they should.God will do as He see`s fit when He get`s the chance,and He will get the chance.
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noloyalisti replies:
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That sounds like a threat from the almighty. That's pretty strong for just a man made idea of existence of the Lord.
shierp replies:
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Janet,
If you say anything about treligion, they will swarm like flies to attack you and your faith. They prayed for a pony on their sixth birthday and never forgave God for not getting them one.
slow-news-day replies:
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Well, basically, perish, it's because you're willing to throw reason and the Constitution out of the window in favor of it.
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shierp says:
If any one reads the judges ruling they would notice that he does not base his findings on any violations of rights. That is because the United States has not officially recognized sexual orientation as a right. The Supreme Court has not even given it suspect status which would put it in a kind of unofficial rights category. Since it does not have "rights" status under the law, it can not have a "rights" violation. Why do you think the courts can't repeal DADT?
Gays have the same rights of marriage as any one else. Heterosexuals can't marry people of the same gender either. Love is not a quantifiable entity under the law. This ruling stands a good chance of losing on appeal.
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slow-news-day replies:
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They do have the right to protection against discrimination.
shierp replies:
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slow,
on what basis are they being discriminated, legally?
slow-news-day replies:
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I'm not a lawyer, perish, but this is definitely discrimination, and you know it.
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