kykr - What complete garbage! In that case the robbers' gun wasn't even loaded or functional, so the 71 year-old didn't save ANY lives. If you watch the video you can see the old guy blasting away wildly, and it was VERY lucky that he didn't hit one of the customers. He even fired through the outer door with no knowledge of who might be walking past! The fact that he failed to seriously hurt either of the robbers with multiple shots proves that he was NOT a safe person to use a gun in a public place.
If that is the best example you can think of then your argument is totally empty.
Holmes wanted to work, but his only offer came from McDonald's. He clearly did not want to study for a PhD as an alternative to working.
The chancellor of UC Riverside described him as "the top of the top academically".
Acquaintances said he was "nice" and "responsible".
His only shortcoming was shyness.
I once read at the back of "Time" or "Newsweek" magazine an essay from an American hiring manager, who wrote, "We don't want people with straight 'A's'; we want 'people people' ".
In the country where I live, Holmes would have easily obtained a job based upon his intelligence. Maybe I now understand why Australia's foreign minister, who said, "Foreign leaders see America in decline".
This should be a speedy trial. 12 counts of murder and 58 counts of attempted murder. When he is sentenced he should get 1 week to live and then killed. Only in America can you commit such a hanus crime and then recieve 3 meals a day with a roof over your head, motel 8 like living conditions, basic eye and dental, cloths, and the best part is the tax payers will pick up the bill. We don't want to be inhumane to anyone who murders out of cold blood.
IF SENTENCED TO DEATH IT WILL TAKE YEARS IF NOT DECADES TO CARRY OUT IF NO DOUBT OF INNOCENCE DEATH SHOULD BE CARRIED OUT QUICKLY REMEMBER 12 DEAD COUNTLESS INJURED PHYSICALLY AND MENTALLY HEALING WILL TAKE YEARS BUT WE NEVER FORGET GOD BLESS THE FAMILIES , FRIENDS AND THE LOST
What I'd like to know, and not just in relation to this case, is how exactly it's determined if someone is mentally ill, and also the extent to which it's supposed to effect the functioning of the guilty's mind. It seems to me that the medical profession and others need to explain and illustrate the facts behind their conclusion. Would a brain scan or some type of scientific test offer some physical evidence to support their diagnosis that someone is mentally ill or criminally insane? What is the medical procedure that determines if someone qualifies for this category, for at present it seems that the public - regardless of their opinion of the Death Penalty - are just informed of that diagnosis, yet the science behind it is never explained. Such an approach merely antagonizes an already outraged public, and leads to bitterness and a 'we're not worthy of an explanation' viewpoint. There's a danger that those professionals will be seen to have a superior, 'we know best and you'll just have to accept it' attitude. That's dangerous when lives have needlessly been lost, and a fearful public are looking for answers in terms of justice or anything else. There are many questions in each of the various areas that such cases give rise to, but little in relation to the public's right to know. There is is a danger that this could be interpreted as 'they're not good enough to be informed or entrusted to consider the findings maturely.' Don't underestimate the public's capacity to think for themselves when the facts are presented to them. Treat them better, they deserve it and it's their right.
'legalbutnotjust' firstly thanks very much for your reply, you raise some very valid points. In regards to any 'plan' he may have had; well, after reading about it all in our media, this is where I became more confused. There were facts - (if that's the correct phrase) - stating he'd purchased several guns in the space of a month, along with ammunition. I suppose that one could also include the materials for the explosive devices he'd rigged in his flat too. The part that confuses me is whether, and/or how that would constitute pre-meditated murder - from a medical point of view and consequently legal too. Or more specifically, how they interpret someone is criminally insane, yet given the degree of preperation he undertook, is still deemed incapable of rational thought. In other words do they consider he was capable of seeing through any illness he may have had, and being aware and conscious enough to know what he was doing in his own mind, or was his deceit and perverse line of thought influenced by any illness regardless of the complexity of his preparatory actions. I suppose the main thrust of the thing is what's the threshold to determining at what point a mentally sick individual can no longer think normally and appreciate the consequences his future actions will have on others, How is it determined that someone can be 'aware' enough to prepare and commit murder, yet not be aware that something is wrong with them and not seek help. The brain is not an infallible organ, but in as far as its functioning when ill is concerned - how does one measure self-awareness in a abnormal brain? I'm not sure whether this post makes sense, as I find it difficult translating my thoughts to a comment. Lol, I know what I want to say but find it difficult as a layman to do so when being bereft of the expertise necessary in the first place. Still, thanks very much for those points you made.
I'd say the suspect was at least partially delusional when he committed & planned for his acts.
But even if he wasn't, & if we assume he is merely a psychopath that doesn't excuse us of putting him to death.
Psychopaths aren't classified as legally insane, since they KNOW the difference of what society thinks is right & wrong. However, true psychopaths are incapable to CARE about what is right & wrong. That is killing a person to a psychopath triggers the same emotional reaction as stepping on a bug for a non-psychopath (i.e. very little emotions)
So while we should keep murderous psychopaths locked safely for the rest of their life for the purpose of public safety. We can't morally justify putting them to death, if psychopaths are deprived of the emotions governing moral behavior as a color-blind person is deprived of seeing in colors.
When someone psychotic or not takes anothers life in cold blood all morals go out the window. I don't care what he was thinking I'm sure at some point over the last 24 years he has probably picked up on whats right and whats wrong even if he had the worst parents in the world. So morally speaking we should lock him up for the rest of his life, feed him 3 meals a day, he will recieve a basic eye and dental plan while locked up as well, and oh yeah us tax payers will all pay for it.
This is what is wrong with America. You take a life in cold blood, your life should be taken. I can bring up an endless list of murderers who took a life served there sentance and was released and did it again.
If it was someone close to you that was shot and killed I bet you would change your outlook.
In Arizona now bad guys think twice - probably go to California. Those prone to life threatening illegal acts, home break-ins, robbery, etc., etc, are ever more frequently met by an armed citizen
About protecting that theater, like many places where shooting occur it is a "gun free zone". Look at Ft hood and three other multi-victim zones.
Note also police were already on-site in front of the theater.
by kykr July 23, 2012 4:43 PM EDT As a lawful gun owner, with a lifetime concealed carry permit, I can only dream about how the outcome would have been different had someone such as myself been in that theater. Last week, a 71 year-old -man, WITH A CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT, saved the lives of countless innocent patrons in a Florida internet cafe' with his actions. I don't know what else to say.
As a lawful gun owner, with a lifetime concealed carry permit, I can only dream about how the outcome would have been different had someone such as myself been in that theater. Last week, a 71 year-old -man, WITH A CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT, saved the lives of countless innocent patrons in a Florida internet cafe' with his actions. I don't know what else to say.
kykr - What complete garbage! In that case the robbers' gun wasn't even loaded or functional, so the 71 year-old didn't save ANY lives. If you watch the video you can see the old guy blasting away wildly, and it was VERY lucky that he didn't hit one of the customers. He even fired through the outer door with no knowledge of who might be walking past! The fact that he failed to seriously hurt either of the robbers with multiple shots proves that he was NOT a safe person to use a gun in a public place.
If that is the best example you can think of then your argument is totally empty.
I know that up until this guy started shooting, he had an imagination of what it would feel like to kill someone. Now, he can imagine for the rest of his short life, what a needle is going to feel like.
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If that is the best example you can think of then your argument is totally empty.
The chancellor of UC Riverside described him as "the top of the top academically".
Acquaintances said he was "nice" and "responsible".
His only shortcoming was shyness.
I once read at the back of "Time" or "Newsweek" magazine an essay from an American hiring manager, who wrote, "We don't want people with straight 'A's'; we want 'people people' ".
In the country where I live, Holmes would have easily obtained a job based upon his intelligence. Maybe I now understand why Australia's foreign minister, who said, "Foreign leaders see America in decline".
But even if he wasn't, & if we assume he is merely a psychopath that doesn't excuse us of putting him to death.
Psychopaths aren't classified as legally insane, since they KNOW the difference of what society thinks is right & wrong. However, true psychopaths are incapable to CARE about what is right & wrong. That is killing a person to a psychopath triggers the same emotional reaction as stepping on a bug for a non-psychopath (i.e. very little emotions)
So while we should keep murderous psychopaths locked safely for the rest of their life for the purpose of public safety. We can't morally justify putting them to death, if psychopaths are deprived of the emotions governing moral behavior as a color-blind person is deprived of seeing in colors.
This is what is wrong with America. You take a life in cold blood, your life should be taken. I can bring up an endless list of murderers who took a life served there sentance and was released and did it again.
If it was someone close to you that was shot and killed I bet you would change your outlook.
About protecting that theater, like many places where shooting occur it is a "gun free zone". Look at Ft hood and three other multi-victim zones.
Note also police were already on-site in front of the theater.
by kykr July 23, 2012 4:43 PM EDT
As a lawful gun owner, with a lifetime concealed carry permit, I can only dream about how the outcome would have been different had someone such as myself been in that theater. Last week, a 71 year-old -man, WITH A CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT, saved the lives of countless innocent patrons in a Florida internet cafe' with his actions. I don't know what else to say.
Don't yell at me; we glorified Bonnie and Clyde's weaponry being sold...
Or Hitler's car...
Or other things from people we claim to loathe but, in action, seem to revere.
Forgive me for thinking our society is just a tad disingenuous... tearing out of one eye and lusting for money out of the other...
It's been a long day...
-- Office Space
:)
If that is the best example you can think of then your argument is totally empty.