Comments on: "Reform Math" Leaves Some Perplexed

New Curriculum Has Some Parents So Concerned, They're Taking Matters Into Their Own Hands

[emma915]

Math is precise! And every child has to start at the beginning. Andor3's response is totally out of context in describing what our kids/grandchildren are dealing with. We start by teaching them to count -- 1,2,3 -- then add, multiply, divide, etc. Then we teach them that one foot equals 12 inches, 8 ounces equals 1 cup, and build from there. Eventually they will know that in andor3's example, there are 9 full feet and one foot isn't complete. And as to how many people have been on staff for however many months, etc., the answer can't be measured in inches. Kids need to learn that you don't mix apples and oranges. You keep them separate, even if they're all part of the problem you're working on. They learn that there are several other problems to solve before they can solve the one they're working on. You know what's that's called? THINKING!!! Even if the basics have to be memorized, the thinking part has to be achieved to solve the problems.
I can't believe what my granddaughter is learning in mathematics! I for one am going to scroll back up to the petition site for those who are against this new way of teaching math and sign my name to it!

[pwb314]

I am a professional mathematician working for a major research university. There is a distinct difference between mathematics educators and mathematicians. Mathematics educators normally have degrees in education while mathematicians are students of the science of mathematics. Most of my colleagues and I would like to see students trained rigorously in the basics of arithmetic and algebra in their precollege classes. The education theorists running the university education departments and local school boards are the originators of reform mathematics. People planning on attending colleges are being shortchanged by their local schools and most of these students have to take remedial classes to address their shotcomings.

[nofuzzymath]

Reform math's dumbing down of American education needs to be addressed. It is a sad reality and needs to be stopped.

Parent advocacy groups around the nation against reform math have been around for years and more are cropping up.
www.nychold.com
www.illinoisloop.org
www.wheresthemath.com
www.vormath.info


This YouTube video explains the unusual methods taught to children in TERC Investigations and Everyday Math for division and multiplication:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tr1qee-bTZI

On-line petitions are collecting hundreds of signatures from concerned parents who end up teaching their children math at home or hiring tutors and want a return to basics:
http://mysite.verizon.net/vzeubbeq/
http://www.petitiononline.com/cprm/petition.html

Many newspaper articles have been written as well. Google Investigations or Everyday Math to see what comes up and why parents are up in arms about what is happening - those in the unfortunate 25% of schools that have succombed to this educationist snake oil.

[mnwinters]

The report would be disturbing if it was true.
I was watching the show and could not believe parents tolerated 2+2=5 is "close enough".
I then saw it was the book my kids use (one currently, the other several years ago). The program is FULL of calculations that require precise answers. The fact that the reporter took one lesson, concerning estimating, and "reported" that "close enough" was the goal was ill infomred at best and absolutely lying at the worst. My high schooler has done very well in high school math, with this program as his foundation, and my 5th grade daughter is also doing well. CBS should be ashamed.

[a3avon]

"They didn't because these people probably don't exist. Mathematicians, scientists and professors use "reformed math" techniques daily, and there isn't any debate over their value."

You are quite misinformed... More than 200 professors of mathematics and scientists openly expressed their disdain for reform math programs in an open letter to the US Department of Education. These are academics in the world of math and science from Stanford, Harvard, Yale, CalTech, MIT, UC Berkley, UCLA, Cornell, etc. Many Nobel laureates and Fields Medal winners (highest honor in mathematics) and they openly expressed their disdain for the direction the NCTM was leading educators in the teaching of mathematics.

These mathematicians and scientists are still fighting today because they see freshman entering college without the requisite skills for advanced math, they see the paucity of candidates from US schools with the ability to excel in engineering, science, physics, and other highly technical fields, they see the proof of the US. slipping further and further downward in the fields of math and science.

Ask a professor of mathematics at any leading university if they support reform math in its present form and test your theory. I dare you.

[andor3]

"It would have been much more telling had they interviewed mathematicians and scientists, including college professors who do not support these types of methods."

They didn't because these people probably don't exist. Mathematicians, scientists and professors use "reformed math" techniques daily, and there isn't any debate over their value. The only question is how soon and what techniques to use in teaching them to students.

If students tune out before they get there, it is a great loss.

[andor3]

"Math is precise"

This is not only wrong, it can be a dangerous misconception.

Math is absolutely not precise--the precision varies depending on many things. The fact that people keep repeating this misunderstanding just confirms the gaps in "traditional" education.

What IS 10 - 7? If you think you know, then you are incorrect. 3 is not the only correct answer.

Everybody should start with arithmetic, and there has always been a second grader who needed help to learn subtraction--that's irrelevant to this discussion.

But in math terms, there is not enough information to answer. What if I need a board 10 feet long minus 7 inches? What if I need to add 10 cups of flour minus 7 tablespoons? What if I offer to pay you $10 minus 7% for taxes? What if I ask you to finish a project in 10 months with 7 less staff?

In a time when calculations are done by machines, mathematical competence depends more on being able to think and analyze than to calculate.

Because the machines often give very precise answers that are wrong, and it is up to the humans to detect that.

[tonic1661]

Reform maths plays to an audience of the lowest common denominator. Pardon the pun.

Teachers in the past have taught mathematics. Current teachers want easy outs with higher scores so they will not be "left behind". .....results of another george bush bad idea.

[susanhelit]

All the details aren't there, but the fact that the child can't do 10-7 - that says quite enough to me about these methods.

Math is precise. That is what it is. Now, as you learn algebra, or if your teacher teaches you some of the shortcuts - you learn a few methods of approximation, 'reasonable' answers - but that comes after, and is for the slightly tougher problems. (198 * 6 - rather than solve it with long division, figure 198 is approx 200, and 200 * 6 is easy.).

[andor3]

carly710 writes:

"I've been in stores where, if the cash register goes down, the average teen can't even figure out much change to give... "

Logic meltdown there--an experience where a stressed-out clerk dealing with equipment failure fumbles with change, somehow generalizes to the "average teen." It doesn't work that way.

Logic can be included with math. Would remedial Everyday Math help here?