Comments on: Armed And Dangerous

Law Bans Sale Of Firearms To People With A History Of Severe Mental Illness

[davidbadgley]

Here's a great idea folks. As part of the screening process involved in the purchase of a gun of any type make it mandatory the purchaser be given a psychological screening by a qualified mental health professional. But, maybe that's where this is all leading to. How many of the otherwise non-mentally ill out there do you think would survive that type of scrutiny? Personally I would have no problem with a repeal of the 2nd amendment. Maybe then the "mentally ill", as well as others, would be somewhat less likely to be victimized by a non-mentally ill society. Not a bad idea, eh? If the Bush administration's proposal to screen all school children for mental illness succeeds then a network of mental health professionals would already be in place, clipboards in hand, ready to give all potential applicants a chance to prove thier state of mental health!

[davidbadgley]

...p.s. Steve, You should be the poster boy for that class of journalist that,"doesn't let the facts get in the way of a good story." Now I'll see if there's an edition of Frontline on PBS so I can get the taste of your bigoted report out of my mouth.

[davidbadgley]

Steve, After reading some of the responses to your piece I can't help but wonder: how can an otherwise intelligent, talented journalist have come to such conclusions? Your piece has helped to inspire reactionary minds to further errors of logic and conclusion. Other than a desire for ratings I can come up with only one reason for such a distorted view this issue. Steve, You're a bigot!

[samthetvcat]

Oneauta

Are you talking to me, and are you implying that I am stupid or lacking common sense? Thx for the clarification.

Regardless, could you please clarify your stance on 2A? Just curious - thx again . . .

[oneauta]

Reading some of these posts convinces me that I should go out and get a gun to protect myself . . . from those people with guns. Those voices keep talking to me go get a gun and protect myself, you'll be safe if you have a gun, and remember there are the quick and the dead . . . so shoot first and let God sort out the good from the bad.

Do you want me living next door to you sitting in a chair peeking out my curtains loading and unloading my baby?

[samthetvcat]

m37kh

Well if your son has been in and out of jail, is he already precluded from acquiring a firearm as a convicted felon?

And again, I would ask you where exactly do you draw the line on depriving individuals of 2A rights . . . men, blacks, poor, urban dwellers, Southerners . . . I mean as a woman I'm all for gun control, but with 2A being an enumerated right what I take issue with is the deprivation based solely on the fact that the mentally ill lack the voice to fight back unlike men, blacks, etc.

[m37kh]

My son is mentally ill and has been in and out of institutions and jail for the past 15 years. Why would I ever in my right mind ever think that he should be able to purchase a gun??? Don't we think that most people that kill people are crazy anyway? Yes, I agree with all the letters that you have received, our mental health facilities are horrible (that's not a strong enough word), but the thought of my son taking someone else's life like the Virginia Tech. incident..His family must be as devastated as all the people who were the innocent victims. Can't we at least make it difficult for these people to acquire firearms? I know people purchase guns illegally, but because I personally know someone who should never ever be able to carry a gun I find this one step could be a step in the right direction.

[samthetvcat]

part 1
nielklot

Well this is exactly the type of situation that begs for more accurate profiling - how did your coworker's psychotic episode manifest? He had a high-risk job, but in a normal job would he have posed a danger to anybody at work? Did he ever make any threats of violence? Was he competent at his job? Were there any side-effects to the medication or did it basically return him to the level of stability he was at before? Is he married - happily? Does he have any kids - what is their relationship like? Is he receiving ongoing treatment? What was his diagnosis? Is it common in his line of work?

I'd also be curious to know if people believe those who have been treated for mental illness therefore believe all at-risk individuals ought to be deprived of their 2A rights? Men commit many more murders than women, and many more murders by gun than women - so am I correct in assuming you'd agree that men ought to be banned from obtaining guns too? I believe there's also a higher rate of gun murders perpetrated by the poor - I guess by your logic, you'd want to forbid those with less than a certain annual income from getting guns too? Who else tends to commit more gun murders as a class of people - blacks, people who live in cities, those in the South?

[samthetvcat]

part 2
Aren't people who say this law is 'common sense' really saying that 2A ought to be abolished, but they can only get away with abolishing it for people who can't fight back. And that's fine with them? Like I'm still not seeing any distinction, any justification, any awareness of the competing interests that makes this position anything other than discrimination of the mentally ill.

[genome2]

Again Sixty minutes decides to stir up controversy without providing solutions.Their ideas would only punish the mentally ill.There are ways to protect the mentally ill and still prevent them from buying guns ,it would just take a change in the system.

[frozenhyena]

Research has proved time and time again that if all the right resources were available people with mental illness could be supported and treated. We are taking billions of dollars away from hospitals and services that are desperately needed to help identify and treat people with severe mental illness. There are all kinds of messages that go out before a crisis. Our society thrives on the crisis and broadcasts the devestating results instead of what could have been done prior to the event. Let's refocus on the solutions of treatment, support and research for persons with severe mental illness. There is only a small percentage of murderers that go on a rampage there are many more vulnerable persons with mental illness that fall victim to all kinds of criminal abuse and neglect. How are we holding service providers accountable? Society likes to identify someone to blame, let's blame the money horders. Stop Discrimination Now

[advocate551]

As a Licensed Clinical Social Worker who works with the mentally ill on a daily basis, I was disappointed to watch 60 Minutes focus only on the gun control aspect of the VT shooter. However, I guess I should not be surprised to once again observe our nation respond to such a tragedy in a punitive manner, i.e., criminalize the mentally ill as the answer to mass shootings. When will the U.S. learn the value of preventive care and provide adequate services for the mentally ill? I would like to see 60 Minutes do a segment on the current condition of mental health services in the U.S. including funding and inpatient psychiatric services.

[ariess63]

I was outraged and disturbed by this report. As a person with a metal illness I know how important it is to have my privacy rights. A mental illness is a medical condition not a criminal action. If my name was put on a list would it come up on a criminal background check. How would that effect my ability to get a job, rent housing and have custody of my children. Who would want to give a job to or rent an apartment to someone that is deemed to be "possibly" able to "snap" at anytime. I have never been involuntarily commited nor do I have any desire to own a gun, but I have to wonder who's or what rights would be next. There is already a huge stigma attached to people with mental illnesses, this only makes it worse.

[foy6669]

Nielklot

Crime victimization in adults with severe mental illness: comparison with the National Crime Victimization Survey.
MAIN OUTCOME MEASURE: National Crime Victimization Survey, developed by the Bureau of Justice Statistics. RESULTS: More than one quarter of persons with SMI had been victims of a violent crime in the past year, a rate more than 11 times higher than the general population rates even after controlling for demographic differences between the 2 samples (P .001). The annual incidence of violent crime in the SMI sample (168.2 incidents per 1000 persons) is more than 4 times higher than the general population rates (39.9 incidents per 1000 persons) (P .001). Depending on the type of violent crime (rape/sexual assault, robbery, assault, and their subcategories), prevalence was 6 to 23 times greater among persons with SMI than among the general population. CONCLUSIONS: Crime victimization is a major public health problem among persons with SMI who are treated in the community. We recommend directions for future research, propose modifications in public policy, and suggest how the mental health system can respond to reduce victimization and its consequences.

How would you propose for persons with severe mental illness protect themselves?

[atayrie]

There is nothing vague and arbitrary about persons with mental illness and a danger to themselves not being able to purchase firearms. When there is a failure in the system and people die everybody's rights are under the microscope to prevent similar circumstances. If the gun control in place did not prevent this occurance, why would one believe that taking all the guns from law abiding people would protect them? If you call 911 when you hear the downstairs windows breaking in your home, can the police arrive before the intruder gets to your bedroom? I would give up my guns, if I had a security that my protection by any agency could meet that time frame. Until then, remember, militias do not need the right to keep and bear arms, that is what they do and a tool of their trade undisputed. People have the right to keep and bear arms in their own self defense. Police are trained that the use of deadly force is to be applied in defending their own life or the life of another as justifiable. Courts are the shoot and review board of the public. I wonder if we could over legislate an area to a point of convalusion or dilusion leading to a false sense of security?

[oneauta]

No revelations here. It is well known that even the mentally incompetent are entitled to have side-arms. Come in useful for shooting neighbor's cats, the neighbors, the mental health worker, and the scores of people who are whispering about them behind their backs.

Laws become pretty meaningless when there is no intention of enforcing them or the "enabling groups, read that NRA & associates" get the language in the law written to be vague and arbitrary.

Always gave me that warm and comfortable feeling to help a deranged veteran to get the money so he could go out to buy his very own Glock and then say "I was thinking of killing you while we were waiting for the VA to make a decision on my claim."

One auta learn, but lessons learned are quickly ignored. Oh, gunman just shot up a shopping mall, patrons must not have been armed like they shoulda.

[sanity6]

I was shocked to hear former mental health officials say they had no problem with the mentally ill purchasing guns. I'm sorry but there are too many guns in the hands of people who neither need them or should have them. Our neighbor carried a registered, concealed handgun for protection. He got into a fight with a FRIEND and the friend took his weapon and shot him DEAD. Some protection! What a loss! Can't we learn anything from stories like this and the thousands of others?

[nielklot]

I had a coworker who had always expressed his opinion that everyone who wanted a gun (any gun) should be allowed to have it no questions. Later he had a psychotic episode and was dismissed from work (a high risk job) and the company paid for his hospital stay of several months. He was stabilized with medication. About a month after being released he visited and happily related that he had been issued a Federal Firearms License. I called the state office and let them know what I knew and they told me they could not discuss it or do anything about it. I then told them that if he was ever involved in a shooting later on, my conscious would be clear and that I would happily inform the newspaper that I had reported what I knew. A few weeks later, he visited us again and complained that his license was revoked. I have nothing against him and wish him all the success in the world. I just do not believe that someone whose reality depends on self-medicating should be involved in selling/owning guns.

[nielklot]

I had a coworker who had always expressed his opinion that everyone who wanted a gun (any gun) should be allowed to have it no questions. Later he had a psychotic episode and was dismissed from work (a high risk job) and the company paid for his hospital stay of several months. He was stabilized with medication. About a month after being released he visited and happily related that he had been issued a Federal Firearms License. I called the state office and let them know what I knew and they told me they could not discuss it or do anything about it. I then told them that if he was ever involved in a shooting later on, my conscious would be clear and that I would happily inform the newspaper that I had reported what I knew. A few weeks later, he visited us again and complained that his license was revoked. I have nothing against him and wish him all the success in the world. I just do not believe that someone whose reality depends on self-medicating should be involved in selling/owning guns.

[nielklot]

I had a coworker who had always expressed his opinion that everyone who wanted a gun (any gun) should be allowed to have it no questions. Later he had a psychotic episode and was dismissed from work (a high risk job) and the company paid for his hospital stay of several months. He was stabilized with medication. About a month after being released he visited and happily related that he had been issued a Federal Firearms License. I called the state office and let them know what I knew and they told me they could not discuss it or do anything about it. I then told them that if he was ever involved in a shooting later on, my conscious would be clear and that I would happily inform the newspaper that I had reported what I knew. A few weeks later, he visited us again and complained that his license was revoked. I have nothing against him and wish him all the success in the world. I just do not believe that someone whose reality depends on self-medicating should be involved in selling/owning guns.