Comments on: A Pill To Forget?

Can A Medication Suppress Traumatic Memories?

[consciousnes]

What happens later?
Isn't it always what comes back to fester later that really causes the damage?
People who don't deal with something now have the tendency to react or commit some action later on which is just as damaging to others as well as themselves.
Vietnam vets are still committing suicide after all these years because they cannot deal with what they saw back in the 60's & 70's.
We may weaken our consious memory of something, but it never goes away, whether you know it or not, your mind carries all the memories of what ever you have ever seen, tasted, touched, heard, or smelled.
That is why when you smell a certin perfum or oder, you remember your mother or father's cigar or pipe. The taste of what ever treat you mother use to make for you when you were young, etc.
Drugs can be good, but we should use our minds to control our actions and memories, not temporary drugs.
Face up to what has happened and move on.

[mrdavidson1]

As a nurse who spent 20+ years working with emotionally disturbed children I believe the unethical thing would be to not continue the studies related to the use of propranolol for PTSD. Many children who have been abused, and especially those who have been sexually abused are unable to move beyond that point, they have emotional and behavioral disturbances for the rest of their lives. They are unable to learn, and if you can't learn to begin with, I think that the issue of blunting old memories is mute. And if your life has consisted of nothing but horrible abuse, again, the blunting is a mute point. These are the kids who drop out of school, get in trouble with the law, and end up in prison, or abusers themselves.
Remember when our society felt it was unethical to keep people in long-term mental health facilities? These people are now our homeless population or in prison. What is ethical about that?
This is a drug that has already been used in children to control blood pressure, so we already have some data related to its use. I'm afraid with the military funding the research, that it's use in children, where it may really help them lead normal lives, may be held up for years, and what a tragedy this would be! mary

[mrdavidson1]

As a nurse who spent 20+ years working with emotionally disturbed children I believe the unethical thing would be to not continue the studies related to the use of propranolol for PTSD. Many children who have been abused, and especially those who have been sexually abused are unable to move beyond that point, they have emotional and behavioral disturbances for the rest of their lives. They are unable to learn, and if you can't learn to begin with, I think that the issue of blunting old memories is mute. And if your life has consisted of nothing but horrible abuse, again, the blunting is a mute point. These are the kids who drop out of school, get in trouble with the law, and end up in prison, or abusers themselves.
Remember when our society felt it was unethical to keep people in long-term mental health facilities? These people are now our homeless population or in prison. What is ethical about that?

This is a drug that has already been used in children to control blood pressure, so we already have some data related to its use. I'm afraid with the military funding the research, that it's use in children, where it may really help them lead normal lives, may be held up for years, and what a tragedy this would be! mary

[mrdavidson1]

As a nurse who spent 20+ years working with emotionally disturbed children I believe the unethical thing would be to not continue the studies related to the use of propranolol for PTSD. Many children who have been abused, and especially those who have been sexually abused are unable to move beyond that point, they have emotional and behavioral disturbances for the rest of their lives. They are unable to learn, and if you can't learn to begin with, I think that the issue of blunting old memories is mute. And if your life has consisted of nothing but horrible abuse, again, the blunting is a mute point. These are the kids who drop out of school, get in trouble with the law, and end up in prison, or abusers themselves.
Remember when our society felt it was unethical to keep people in long-term mental health facilities? These people are now our homeless population or in prison. What is ethical about that?
Because we have not walked in others' shoes we cannot decide what is or isn't ethical to any given individual.
This is a drug that has already been used in children to control blood pressure, so we already have some data related to its use. I'm afraid with the military funding the research, that it's use in children, where it may really help them lead normal lives, may be held up for years, and what a tragedy this would be! mary

[bmtirtind]

Memory, Adrenalin, Spanking
The logic revealed should demonstrate the need for spanking.
Yesterday a toddler suddenly darted off the side walk and into the parking lot. A car came within a half a foot of the child. The parent simultaneously tried to stop the child and after the car had stopped she moved her child 3 feet back to the sidewalk.
She then spanked her child (hurray!!!)thus releasing adrenalin in the child who will remember not to move off the sidewalk unless instructed.

Thus there is your Scientific Reason for spanking. Anyone who has watched a mama racoon take her kits out for the "safari" weaning has seen the swat and scolding when a kit doesn't stay close. She already knows that in life you most often don't get a second chance.

The same applies for humans. So.... the non spanking human parent, psychologist and state child welfare agency has it all wrong.

[cmahon6]

My grandson was sexually abused by his father and literally tortured by his father's mother between birth and 4 yrs. He is now 9 years old and recently displayed some undesirable behavior, regardless of years of therapy. We do NOT want him to hurt any other child. It sounds to me as though this medicine might help him more than anything else in this world. For his sake and the sake of any children out there he might harm, I hope this medicine is allowed to be researched more thoroughly.

[random_radar]

I think it is interesting that bioethicists want us to suffer from horrible memories. Considering the awful things being treated in these studies, I find it hard to take the ethicists seriously.

Medicine is suppposed to heal our wounds--physical and emotional. More power to doctors who try to help those who suffer.

[sandy19731]

When the rest of the world doesn't understand why a person is not back to their normal self after 7 months, it is hard to explain to them. Sometimes it seems like the pain I feel is going to kill me.
Posted by mominpain at 09:05 PM : Jun 17, 2007

Honey, your name says it all. Please contact your doctor today. My (educated) guess is that you are suffering from post-partum depression. It is VERY treatable and more than 80% curable. Call now!

[sandranj1]

Iraq - excerpt of well known news items below - How can anyone suggest this is NOT an advance and suggest use for those who desire moving on with lives after a traumatic event.
"Every month, 20 to 40 soldiers are evacuated from Iraq because of mental problems, according to the Army. Most are sent to Walter Reed along with other war-wounded. For amputees, the nation's top Army hospital offers state-of-the-art prosthetics and physical rehab programs, and soon, a new $10 million amputee center with a rappelling wall and virtual reality center.

Nothing so gleaming exists for soldiers with diagnoses of post-traumatic stress disorder, who in the Army alone outnumber all of the war's amputees by 43 to 1. The Army has no PTSD center at Walter Reed, and its psychiatric treatment is weak compared with the best PTSD programs the government offers. Instead of receiving focused attention, soldiers with combat-stress disorders are mixed in with psych patients who have issues ranging from schizophrenia to marital strife.

Even though Walter Reed maintains the largest psychiatric department in the Army, it lacks enough psychiatrists and clinicians to properly treat the growing number of soldiers returning with combat stress. Earlier this year, the head of psychiatry sent out an "SOS" memo desperately seeking more clinical help.

Individual therapy with a trained clinician, a key element in recovery from PTSD, is infrequent, and targeted group therapy is offered only twice a week."

[jesmith777]

In responce to Patricia64's comment, I have had absolutely NO side effects from taking the Propranolol.

[patricia64-2009]

This story should be balanced by a look at the non-pill solutions available for the treatment of PTSD. There are non-talking therapies, such as EMDR, acupuncture, homeopathy, yoga, imagery that relieve nervous system trauma without side effects. Drugs ALWAYS have side effects, be it little, be it later. Why do we have such paltry education and press on alternatives?

[jesmith777]

I heard about this 60 minute segment just after it had aired last November. Being a survivor of rape 37 years before, and being sexual assaulted again about 5 years before, I was all to aware of the effects of PTSD.

After contacting Dr. Pitman, Dr. Brunet, and Louise O'Donnell-Jasmin, I ultimately ended up contacting and working with Dr. Mark Barad at UCLA. We utilized Dr. Pitman's protocol for the propranolol study in combination with narrative writing. We had a total of 3 sessions where we reactivated the memoriy, combined with taking propranolol. The day after the sessions, I had daily writing assignments of at least 20 minutes in which I was to write in first person, present tense, intimate detail exactly what happened. Each day I was to reread and add to what I had written. Things that had initially caused hysterical crying while writing about them, ultimately lost all emotional trauma.

The next two steps involved visiting trigger spots, and ultimately starting to do things I had been avoiding.

After 6 weeks the anxiety that had been with me for 37 years which was associated with being raped was GONE!!! This truely been a miracle!!!

[pjdoylesr]

Fun facts about beta-blockers, propanolol [inderal]. As an ER Nurse in the Army years ago I read an article in Journal of Emergency Medicine about the drug's benefit to pianists with stage fright prior to recitals. After drinking coffee all morning I'd take 20 mg before doing a task that took a steady hand [suturing a child's quivering lip] and I was good to go. A surgeon buddy was nervous about his oral boards the next week, so I showed him the article. Grateful after he passed the boards, he gave me a bottle of champagne! First researched by the CIA in the '40's, the drug was given to agents before 'offing' the enemy! It steadies the hand, slows the heart rate, diminishes 'the sweats', all necessary stuff when carrying out an execution. Think about it, you take propanolol before undergoing a polygraph test [even if you're guilty as sin] because it inhibits exactly that which is being measured!

[clockwork-]

Johnzane -

That adrenaline has the ability to affect one%u2019s memory (and in the case of PTSD, cement in a memory) was indeed a central theme.

Toward your specific question, I%u2019m not sure it would work exactly as planned, i.e. give a temporary increase in one%u2019s ability to remember. Even if it helped, it would likely never be suggested as something to practice for an extended time since adrenaline has so many other effects within the body when it's released (increasing heart rate, respiration, releasing glucose, etc.) that long-term usage would have adverse effects. Studying (especially for a larger exam like the SAT) is something that requires a longer span of time where one is concentrating, and as a result wouldn%u2019t especially benefit from a short term boost in adrenaline.

[gaylordt]

I noticed the bottle of Propranolol was 40 MG. I have been on 80 Mg a day for many years for my heart [ angina ] I am 77 yrs old and don't seem to have any more Senior Moments, than all the other senior center friends, but the next time I see my Dr. I will ask
Gaylord

Your program shows a rat who, after learning to swim to a submerged platform in the center of a pool of water only after having circled the perimeter a number of times, swims directly to the platform on a subsequent test, with no circling, after receiving a shot of adrenaline. The experiment suggests adrenaline helps memory.

Would a shot of adrenalin have the same effect on students taking the SAT exams?

Your program shows a rat who, after learning to swim to a submerged platform in the center of a pool of water only after having circled the perimeter a number of times, swims directly to the platform on a subsequent test, with no circling, after receiving a shot of adrenaline. The experiment suggests adrenaline helps memory.

Would a shot of adrenalin have the same effect on students taking the SAT exams?

Your program shows a rat who, after learning to swim to a submerged platform in the center of a pool of water only after having circled the perimeter a number of times, swims directly to the platform on a subsequent test, with no circling, after receiving a shot of adrenaline. The experiment suggests adrenaline helps memory.

Would a shot of adrenalin have the same effect on students taking the SAT exams?

[hvnbnd4hvnsk]

As a CURRENT and most likely lifetime prescribed user of propranolol, I feel for those of you who feel this drug actually somehow works in the brain to erase memory. To put it in the simplest form I know how, is this drug blocks the sympathetic nervous system, a part of the involuntary nervous system, by blocking these actions, IT REDUCES THE HEART RATE. It is most frequently used, as myself, for HYPERTENSION, also for ABNORMAL HEART RATES, ANGINA, MIGRAINES, TREMORS and THYROTOXICOSIS, (high thyroid hormone count). It aides in how people react to traumatic memories by keeping them calm, not erasing the memories. No one is going to forget their life experiences. Please look up Propranolol on the web and then make INFORMED decisions before jumping to conclusions or judging others. 60 minutes just used the headline "Erase Memory" to lure us in, no different then those hideous papers in the check out line. It is the media and the nature of the beast to appeal to our curiosity. God Bless You All

[mominpain]

When the rest of the world doesn't understand why a person is not back to their normal self after 7 months, it is hard to explain to them. All I know is that life at its best is stressfull and demanding and then add a shocking abnormal experience that literally rattles every fiber of your soul and the desperation that arises leads a person to the point of trying anything that might bring about some releif. Sometimes it seems like the pain I feel is going to kill me.