Where is Mitt Romney's faith?

Republican presidential candidate, former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney, left, takes a walk with his wife Ann, on the beach after a campaign stop at Holland State Park on Tuesday, June 19, 2012 in Holland, Mich. (AP Photo/Evan Vucci)

/ Evan Vucci

This post originally appeared on Slate.

(CBS News) Mitt Romney is coy about his running mate. He'll only speak about the topic in the broadest terms. His staff won't talk about it at all. To be fair, they don't know much about the subject. It's something very personal to Romney.

I am talking about his religion.

This is the high season of speculation about Mitt Romney's vice presidential pick (Rubio's not being vetted!), but the other issue they keep locked up in Romney's Boston headquarters is far more likely to affect his presidency than who his No. 2 will be. It's obvious why Romney wants to control the coverage of both issues. He wants to announce his vice presidential pick on his terms for maximum political benefit. With his religion, he wants to control the conversation to limit the political downside.

Watch Romney talk about the process to choose his running mate in the video to the left.

It is a truism of the vice presidential selection process that the people who talk don't know, and the people who know, don't talk. That's not the same with religion. Fellow Mormons know what it's like to be as devout as Romney and what that would mean for his presidency. They write op-eds in the newspaper; they have blogs. Two leaders in the church spoke on Monday at the Faith Angle Forum on Mormonism in Washington, D.C. and it was clear that they think Romney's faith isn't something to hide, but is a selling point. By explaining his faith and his role in the church, Romney could show why he is not as walled off from regular people as President Obama claims. Describing how his religious values have shaped him would explain why he makes decisions with such rigor and is so restless in his pursuit of excellence.

When Michael Otterson, the Managing Director of Public Affairs for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, who participated in the forum, talked about the faith, he described a religion especially compatible with the office of the presidency. "Mortal life is a test, a probationary period in eternal progression," he explained, which accounts for Mormons' relentless work ethic, deep ties to the community, and particularly rigorous decision making. Romney, as a devout and active member, has all of these qualities because, as Otterson says, "a passive attitude of faith is no part of being a Latter-day Saint."

The Mormon faith, in this view, is not something that a President Romney would passively carry with him into office; it would be a central driver of his presidency. "If you want to offer to America the full package of who he is, if you don't [talk about his religion], you lose a very important half of what's shaped his life," says Clayton Christensen, a professor at Harvard Business School and author of How Will You Measure Your Life? "I don't think there's a whole lot for him to be ashamed of--as you dig deeper and deeper you'll be able to show exactly who he is."

Watch Romney talk to reporters on the campaign plane in the video to the left.

Romney's faith would inform a Romney presidency in two important ways: his decision making process and his capacity to show empathy for those who don't share his immediate experience. Both men described Mormon prayer not as a reason-free appeal for the divine thumbs-up or thumbs-down, but a process that calls a person to a special kind of rigor and engagement with life's choices, before they ever seek God's guidance.New York Times reporter Jodi Kantor, who participated in the discussion and has written on Romney's religion, pointed to the passage in the Doctrine and Covenants that she said was cited repeatedly by Romney's friends when discussing his decision making process. Guidance from God won't come unless you think it through first: "Behold, you have not understood; you have supposed that I would give it unto you, when you took no thought save it was to ask me. But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind."

The second aspect of Romney's faith that would inform his presidency is his time as a bishop in an LDS congregation in Massachusetts in the 1980s. In that role, the equivalent to a pastor, Romney counseled members of his ward about their most personal matters. "The fact that Mitt was a Mormon bishop in a ward that had one of every conceivable type of human," says Christensen, who has also served as a bishop. "He personally ... met with them in their home and just had a very deep sense of what was going on in that family. That is another really important attribute. He feels it, whereas other people voted for legislation that took money from these people to give to those people. That's not an understanding of humanity."

It is not surprising to hear adherents to a faith make a strong case for it, but it does highlight how far Mitt Romney has positioned himself from those with whom he shares this fundamental bond. Though these men think Romney's faith should be discussed, Romney does not want to discuss it. That is certainly the politically wise choice. Romney wants the conversation to be about President Obama's failures. Fascinating details about Romney's life and religion distract from that.

A conversation about religion would almost certainly go horribly wrong: Romney would get stuck defending Mormon doctrine in a way a Catholic would never have to defend the worship of relics. When a New York Times columnist jokes about tenets of the Mormon faith in a way the paper would not likely tolerate were it about another religion, Romney is wise to decide the deck is stacked against him in the mainstream press.

Watch Romney take on Obama protesters in the video to the left.

Even if Romney could find a sympathetic forum, he isn't a good storyteller. He lacks the narrative talents to tell the kinds of stories that Christensen would like him to tell about his time as a bishop. Those stories are complex and not all of them are favorable to Romney, who battled with feminists in Massachusetts and whose role as a church voice on issues of homosexuality, out of wedlock births, and a host of other social issues would put him in a thicket of nettlesome debates he doesn't want to have.

A discussion of Mormonism would certainly be intellectually interesting and theologically useful. David Mason, a professor at Rhodes College and devout Mormon, argues that Mormonism is not the same as Christianity, which raises fascinating religious questions. But in politics, fascinating is usually synonymous with deadly. Christensen argues, for example, that the LDS church provides the best template for Christian living that exists. Discuss! No thanks, says Mitt Romney, who does not want to offend evangelical voters he'll need in battleground states like Iowa, Virginia, and North Carolina.

But there's more to Romney's religion than the theological side. As Joanna Brooks, who writes frequently on Mormonism, argues so persuasively, "It is important for readers to know that Romney developed his leadership style in a non-democratic, patriarchal, hierarchical church culture where he rarely encountered open challenge." Romney has been a leader in several different arenas: in government, in business, in helping organize the Olympic Games, and in his church. The campaign asks us to examine and approve of three of those four areas--and then walls off discussion of Romney's religious leadership.

Mitt Romney has no interest in being an ambassador for the Mormon church any more than Barack Obama wanted to have a protracted conversation about race in 2008. In that way, both men are alike. They have both designed their political lives in ways that hide core parts of their identity. Unlike with his vice presidential pick, Romney will not be getting more specific about his other running mate any time soon.

[lindaj1940]

To zbcbs - I am 71 years old. I remember well all the deferments allowed by the government during the Vietnam war. My 1st husband was deferred because I was pregnant with our first child. Those who were in school could get a deferment. Missionaries were given a deferment. Many, many, men used these deferments. A lot of people did not support the Vietnam War. I don't know how Mitt Romney felt about the War. Most LDS families consider serving as a missionary a very important part of their life. My second husband pretended to be gay so he wouldn't have to go. I divorced both of my husbands). People live by the times they live in. In the LDS Church Bishops (equivalent to a pastor of a congregation) are called by their Stake President (equivalent to a leader of a parish). They do not seek this office and they serve without pay. They generally serve for 5 years and then they are released and another is called to replace them. Being a Bishop is not a life time calling. Only the General Authorities such as the First Presidency of the Church serve for life. Just wanted to clarify your misinformation.

[amormon]

Some of the quotes of Brigham Young and others attempting to show Joseph Smith will somehow judge the world are taken out of context. We believe there are several "dispensations" in the history of the world headed by various leaders chosen by God. They will be the spokesman for a particular time in the history of the world. That is Moses will have the responsibility to judge the dispensation he was called to bring forth the teachings of God to the people of his time. Who are some of the others that will head a dispensation? Peter, Adam, Abraham Joseph Smith, Moses and so forth will have this responsibility. Each will have a say so in who pass muster for their particular generation or dispensation. And each of these Prophet/leaders will turn over their respective judgments to Christ. Peter will have the responsibility to guard the gates of heaven but Christ is The judge and final arbitrator of who will go where.

[teofilia9]

amormon...

if you could document or give me some references as to your statements of 'being out of context" submitted by the leadership of the LDS or even yourself where the originals texts i quoted have been changed i would be happy to read them and adjust my statements accordingly......

teo..

[TLUnrine1]

Amazing how any time a quote is embarrassing toe Mormons, it is taken out of context, or is not official doctrine, official quotes, seems like Mormonism is like a Supertanker running at full steam without a rubber - no one at the helm; even the foolish General Authorities putting out propaganda books always have a disclaimer - hey, I'm an Apostle, but I don't speak officially for the Mormon church, especially if what I say becomes an embarrassment.

Christ's Apostles didn't have that problem.

Big different between real Apostles, and perceived Apostles.

[tea412]

Where is his faith? Internalized, where it should be. He doesn't need to make this his running mate - indeed neither he nor anyone else should.

[teofilia9]

tea412...

why shouldn't he have to explain his faith....its bought up every presidential election.....

look...this topic can be put to rest...all he has to say is his salvation is attained soley on the death and ressurrection of jesus christ......and not having to attain salvation based of the belief of joesph smith first.....or having to get his permission

read my other commentary about the mormon beliefs on this topic with documention of where you can look up these you so choose

[tea412]

teofilia9

He has already said be believes exactly what you just said. Then people say that isn't enough - what about...

I don't need to know every mormon belief to know what I need to vote. It simply isn't relevant.

[sfcanative]

Anyone who . . . believes the Garden of Eden and the beginning of mankind occurred in Independence, Missouri . . . believes Christ's advance team will announce the "2nd Coming" at a Mormon temple and city in Missouri . . . believes in order to go to heaven and be in god's presence you must gain approval from Mormonism founder Joseph Smith . . . believes blacks were cursed with a dark skin by god for things they did in the pre-mortal life . . . believes a sixteen year old farm boy was visited by God, Christ and angels during the Second Great Awakening at the "Burned-over District" of Upstate New York, then told of a hidden box of golden plates which he translated into the 'Book of Mormon' seven years later by looking into a hat with a magic stone . . . believes 3 "Nephites" mentioned in the "Book of Mormon" walk the earth today ministering to Mormons (and potentially Willard Romney in the Oval Office ???) . . . believes God lives on a planet near the star Kolob with a human spokesman in Salt Lake City . . . believes special Freemasonry handshake rituals in the Mormon temple entitle that person to an exclusive pathway past the sentinels leading to heaven . . . does not have my vote for President of the United States.

[teofilia9]

sfcanative....

i concur wth your findings....although tere are some responders on this site that have trouble accepting my proof about joseph smith being the way to heaven/salvation not jesus......

i would hope that you post with your proofs the documentation of where they can be found in the mormons own historical documents and and more current speaches,,,,,this way your evidece is irrefutable..all they to have do it look it up...problem is the mormons on the site refuse to look any documentaion up.

the stickler on this topic is that i cant vote for romney only because of the fact that he is a mormon and holds to the evidence that i have presented......if he don't then he's a fake mormon....the evidence i have give are their core beliefs.....the mormon website is bias..plain fact.,,,,,you will not this documentation and info such as yours becaue the site has been 'washed'....too many people knowing is not good for them

[sfcanative]

@Teo: The problem with today's Mormons is their wholesale denial of many teaching put forward by Brigham Young and Mark E. Peterson. In particular, Brigham Young's teachings cause today's apologists all sorts of consternation. It really is rather remarkable that something taught by a Mormon "prophet, seer and revelator" during the founding days of the LDS Church, is blown off by today's Mormon spin doctors. There's only one explanation: either The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints disappeared with the death of Joseph Smith (since today's Mormons clearly reject the teachings of his successor, Brigham Young) or today's Salt Lake City branch of Mormonism is going through its own apostasy by rejecting the revealed teachings of their prophets since 1844.

"...and he that confesseth not that Jesus has come in the flesh and sent Joseph Smith with the fullness of the Gospel to this generation, is not of God, but is Antichrist," (Mormon prophet Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 9, p. 312).

"...no man or woman in this dispensation will ever enter into the celestial kingdom of God [God's presence] without the consent of Joseph Smith," (Mormon prophet Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 7, p. 289).

"I am here to answer. I shall be on hand to answer when I am called upon, for all the counsel and for all the instruction that I have given to this people. If there is an Elder here, or any member of this Church, called the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, who can bring up the first idea, the first sentence that I have delivered to the people as counsel that is wrong, I really wish they would do it; but they cannot do it, for the simple reason that I have never given counsel that is wrong; this is the reason." (Mormon prophet Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 16, p. 161).

[sfcanative]

Mormonism at its very core teaches a sweeping premise about the earth and all of mankind. The very end of the "latter days" are apparently upon us as a bleak outlook promises the universal failure of governments around the world, social chaos, wars and desolation at every turn. Israel will face complete annihilation by an invader from the north. There will be no place to hide as dismay washes over all gentiles (non-Mormons) only to be replaced by abject despair. When all hope is completely lost, the Mormon Jesus will return to earth in judgment, setting up a world government headquartered in Independence, Missouri, to be run by the Mormons.

http://www.ldsmag.com/article/7058

This doctrinal outlook on the future of the world, its governments, and scenario for a religious Armageddon, has inevitably colored Mitt Romney's mindset on how to handle domestic and foreign affairs. In Romney's eyes, his "calling" and chosen purpose in God's hands if elected, will be to further the final preparations for Armageddon and a Mormon caliphate.

This is not someone, despite certain business skills, I want occupying the Oval Office.

[bkswrites]

Indeed. Brrrr.

[teofilia9]

bytebear..i have so much evidence of salvation through joseph smith we can go on for a long time.....here's a few more


In his article entitled "Joseph Smith Among the Prophets" printed in the June 1994 issue of "Ensign" magazine, Mormon writer Robert L. Millet quoted second LDS Prophet Brigham Young, who, in 1859, stated, "From the day that the priesthood was taken from the earth to the winding up things of all things, every man and woman must have the certificate of Joseph Smith, junior, as a passport to their entrance into the mansion where God and Christ are -- I with you and you with me. I cannot go there without his consent" (Journal of Discourses 7:238. See also Search These Commandments, 1984, pg. 133).

Along those same lines Brigham Young also taught, "How are you going to get your resurrection? You will get it by the President of the resurrection pertaining to this generation, and that is Joseph Smith Jun. Hear it all ye ends of the earth; if ever you enter into the kingdom of God it is because Joseph Smith let you go there. This will apply to Jews and Gentiles, to the bond, and the free; to friends and foes; no man or woman in this generation will get a resurrection and be crowned, without Joseph Smith saying so. The man who was martyred in Carthage Jail, State of Illinois, holds the keys of life and death to this generation. He is the President of the resurrection in this dispensation, ..." (An unpublished Discourse given October 8, 1854. Also found on page 99 of Eugene E. Campbell's book entitled, "The Essential Brigham Young").

George Q. Cannon, a former member of the First Presidency, also said that Joseph Smith plays a pivotal role in the salvation plan. "If we get our salvation, we shall have to pass by him; if we enter into our glory, it will be through the authority that he has received" (Gospel Truth, pp. 199, 200).

These statements remove all doubt that if true salvation is to be gained, Joseph Smith must play a part in it. Such teachings are an offense to the Christian who holds the Bible dear. John 5:22 declares, "For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son." It is the righteous judgment of Jesus Christ the Mormon must fear, not Joseph Smith.

Millet compared Joseph Smith's death to that of Jesus Christ when he wrote, "...the life of Joseph Smith was in some degree patterned after that of his Master, Jesus Christ. That pattern holds true even when extended to its tragic conclusion. Like his Master, Joseph Smith shed his blood in order that the final testament, the reestablishment of the new covenant, might be in full effect" (pg. 22).

Millet went on to quote LDS President Harold B. Lee who said, "Many have belittled Joseph Smith, but those who have will be forgotten in the remains of mother earth, and the odor of their infamy will ever be with them, but honor, majesty, and fidelity to God, exemplified by Joseph Smith and attached to his name, will never die" (ibid., pg. 23).

Such comments should be expected given the fact that Brigham Young labeled those who do not recognize Joseph Smith as anti-christs. On July 13, 1862, Young declared, "...he that confesseth not that Jesus has come in the flesh and sent Joseph Smith with the fulness of the Gospel to this generation, is not of God, but is anti-christ" (JOD 9:312

[bytebear]

And as I said, Christianity has a very common story of St. Peter guarding the gates of Heaven. So what's the difference? Can you be saved but reject the testimony of Paul? Can you reject Moses? Abraham? Can Catholics abandon Mary?

[TLUnrine1]

bytebear - what's the differece?

Christianity - the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Mormons - the false gospel of Mormonism and Joe Smith - forewarned by Paul and Peter many times.

[teofilia9]

doug

...no salvation without going joseph smith.....here it comes just look it up.....no games here just truth..another irrefutable truth

No heaven without Joseph Smith's approval.

Early Mormon leader Heber Kimball said of Joseph Smith, "He has passed beyond the veil, but there will never be a person in this dispensation enter into the celestial glory without his approbation." (Journal of Discourses 4:119)

[bytebear]

That would be akin to no salvation with out St. Peter letting you in the gate.

[teofilia9]

doug if you would be willing to respond to this evidence of the mindset of mormons i would appreciate ad then we could have dialog....i'm giveng you the quote and the place to look it up...would there be a reason why you wouldn't at least look at your archives...its in there plain as it is stated below....

They, according to Apostle Bruce McConkie of the Mormon Church, do not worship Jesus. McConkie says, "We worship the Father and Him only, and no one else. We do not worship the Son and we do not worship the Holy Ghost. Christ worked out his own salvation by worshipping the Father." (BYU speech, 3-2-1982)

[bytebear]

Wow, one obscure speech. McConkie was also chastised by church leaders for presenting "misleading or false information" in his book Mormon Doctrine.

[TLUnrine1]

bytebear- proves the point, when caught with an embarrassing truth, deny the comment, tear down the writer.

So for an Apostle, who was chosen by revelation to be an Apostle, so he must be enspired, unless the truth stinks?

Makes his comments carry more weight when so many Mormons say NOT TRUE.

[teofilia9]

Despite this biblical truth, Joseph Fielding Smith, Mormonism's tenth president, went on record as saying that there is "no salvation without Joseph Smith." (Doctrine of Salvation 1:189).

prove me wrong.....what document or writing can change this quote...its still in my copy of Doctrines

[bytebear]

"And we talk of Christ, we rejoice in Christ, we preach of Christ, we prophesy of Christ, and we write according to our prophecies, that our children may know to what source they may look for a remission of their sins." - 2 Nephi 25:26 (Book of Mormon)

"The fundamental principles of our religion are the testimony of the Apostles and Prophets, concerning Jesus Christ, that He died, was buried, and rose again the third day, and ascended into heaven; and all other things which pertain to our religion are only appendages to it" - Joseph Smith

http://jesuschrist.lds.org/SonOfGod/eng/his-life-and-teachings/articles/we-believe

[teofilia9]

doug..

the book all mormons should read is "MORMONISM...shadow or reality?"

written by 2 former lds members jerald and sandra turner..who left once they dug deep into the real teachings of mormonism....

this is a massive complication of photos of newspaper articles...documentes with dates...ledgers....signatures and writings of many early lds presidents like brigham young..etc....

everthing is there for you to read and look at...then go and cut and paste the following url to start your new journey


http://www.mrm.org/no-salvation-without-joseph-smith