Occupy Wall Street: More popular than you think

AP Photo/Andrew Burton

The conservative criticism of the Occupy Wall Street movement is that it is a "growing mob" (House majority leader Eric Cantor) of "shiftless protestors" (The Tea Party Express) engaged in "class warfare" (GOP presidential candidate Herman Cain) whose grievances - whatever they are - are far outside the political mainstream.

The polls don't back that up.

A new survey out from Time Magazine found that 54 percent of Americans have a favorable impression of the protests, while just 23 percent have a negative impression. An NBC/Wall Street Journal survey, meanwhile, found that 37 percent of respondents "tend to support" the movement, while only 18 percent "tend to oppose" it.

The findings suggest that the right's portrait of the movement as a collection of lazy hippies who need to stop whining - to "take a shower and get a job" (Bill O'Reilly) - isn't resonating with most Americans.

That's because while the protesters' aims are vague - Bill Clinton said Wednesday that they need to start advocating specific political goals - their frustrations are easily identifiable and widely shared. The Occupy movement may be a big tent (one with room for opposition to fracking, calls for campaign finance reform, and a host of other positions), but nearly everyone involved says they are angry that a small group of wealthy Americans have grown increasingly rich while "the other 99 percent" have been left behind.

That's a belief that seems to be shared by Americans across the political spectrum. In 2010, as CBSNews.com reported in a story on the income and wealth divide last month, researchers and Harvard and Duke asked Americans how they thought wealth is spread among income groups, as well as how they thought it should be spread. Overwhelmingly, Americans said they wanted a more equitable distribution of wealth; they also underestimated just how large the wealth divide has grown. (See chart below.)

CBS

As the study's authors noted, "All groups - even the wealthiest respondents - desired a more equal distribution of wealth than what they estimated the current United States level to be." Republicans, Democrats, independents, as well as rich, middle class and poor all said that wealth shouldn't be so concentrated among the highest earners.

That goes a long way toward explaining the Occupy movement's potential staying power and cultural resonance. While most Americans wouldn't camp out in the freewheeling quasi-society that has sprung up in Lower Manhattan, the vast majority seem to share the protesters' sense that the economic deck is stacked. They've seen the government bail out the banks that helped create the economic crisis, seen corporate profits hit all-time high after all-time high, seen CEO pay balloon to 350 times that of the average worker. They've seen average hourly earnings (adjusted for inflation) stagnate for half a century while CEO pay increased 300 percent since 1990. They've seen social mobility decline and friends and neighbors join the ranks of the long-term unemployed while the wealthiest Americans have had their tax burden reduced and have increased their share of the nation's wealth. (For the details behind these statistics, see the extraordinary valuable graphics put together by Business Insider.)

There's no denying that some of the protesters fit critics' characterization of them - many, though certainly not all, of the most committed demonstrators are the sort of outspoken young leftists that O'Reilly seems to disdain. And there's no question there is a wide variety of opinions about how to move forward - both within the movement and the public at large. But the polls and the data suggest that the protesters' underlying concerns resonate widely. Occupy Wall Street may have an uncertain future - demonstrators in New York may be de facto evicted Friday morning - but it clearly seems to have tapped into a widespread sense that the economic system is out of whack. And that makes it far more difficult for critics to blithely dismiss the protesters as outside the American mainstream.

90 Photos

Anti-Wall Street protests, coast-to-coast

[BJAY8318]

In our previous comments, we explained why so many are joining and/or supporting "Occupy Wall Street"! As of the latest revelations last night (11/13/11) on "60" Minutes, we see that the mantle should be expanded to "Occupy Wall Street and Capital Hill"! With Congress allowed (by themselves)to make the rules up as they go and exempt all but themselves from any penalties, it sounds like the old adage of the Inmates running the assylum? For all of you honest and hard working investors who take the time, effort and money to research potential investments, knowing that your ability or lack thereof could make you money or put you in the poor house, Congressmen and Senators have created their own stock market and real estate investment scheme to make sure that they win at all costs (yours)!This is like heads I win, tails you lose. Why do you join organizations to assist you in making knowledgebale decisions in the market when the game is 'RIGGED'? Yesterday, this may have seemed as Hyperbole, but today it is a reality and a given. You may do better to take that thousand dollars and 'mail' it directly to Las Vegas Navada and have them play 'Black Jack'/ or poker for you.( or your favorite gamne of choice). And that's not hyperbole! I'm sure that you will receive your winings in the mail. That would be a safer decision, I think?

[BJAY8318]

I'm surprised that anyone can ask what the "Occupy" movement is all about! Let me give a few real life examples to insure that this is no mystery. (a) Jack Abramoff, the Wall Street trader that was just released from jail, gave an inside account on this past Sunday's 60 Minutes broadcast, with Lesley Stahl, of how he worked the halls of Congress and had 'your chosen representatives' eating from his hand. This is no surprise, but his playbook included specific tactices like promising a 'Chief of Staff' of a congressman a job when they left government, obviously paying much more than they were making. He said "From that day on, any thing that he needed or asked, was a DONE DEAL!!(b) Last week Chris Como interviewed a congressaman from either North or South Carolina, who has single handedly said that he is trying to cut back on the largess that he and his fellow representatives get from the Federal Goverment. He knows that it is 'Day Light robbery', but how do you get any representative to vote less pay or benefits for themselves, when they control all the decision making power? It has not, for some strange and unexplained reason, not even being let come up to a committee vote? I guess they will have to live with being in higher and higher income ranges, thus having to pay more taxes? Oh that's right, they are standing firm that 3,200 individuals who make over a million dollars a year should not have to pay anymore, but 900,000 middle class tax payers is alright? What's wrong with that picture? (c) Lastly, and hot off today's press (11-12-11)is the news that the heads of money pits, Fannie Mae, and Freddie Mac, are receiving large bonuses on top of their $900,000.00+ dollar salaries!!!!!!!!!! The rationale by the Federal agency that oversees these organizations, is that they have to offer these large bonuses and incentives to attract the top talent.Tim Geithner, Secretary of the US Treasury, only makes $200K. I can see why they gave that explanation, It makes so much sense. So far, they have borrowed over $170,000,000,000.00 Billion and are back looking for more as of this past week. I guarantee, with no financial education, I could lose as much as they have and just hire a bright tax attorney to keep me from paying too much of my income, especially with all the friends that I'd have in the House of Representatives that think I should not pay one 'thin dime' extra money! I could create more jobs, like didn't happen from 2000 to 2008, unless I misunderstood the trickle down job creating theory?
This is the tip of the proverbial iceberg. Just with these three examples, is there anyone who makes less than a million dollars (middle class)not Get It as to why the Occupy Movement??

[BJAY8318]

I'm surprised that anyone can ask what the "Occupy" movement is all about! Let me give a few real life examples to insure that this is no mystery. (a) Jack Abramoff, the Wall Street trader that was just released from jail, gave an inside account on this past Sunday's 60 Minutes broadcast, with Lesley Stahl, of how he worked the halls of Congress and had 'your chosen representatives' eating from his hand. This is no surprise, but his playbook included specific tactices like promising a 'Chief of Staff' of a congressman a job when they left government, obviously paying much more than they were making. He said "From that day on, any thing that he needed or asked, was a DONE DEAL!!(b) Last week Chris Como interviewed a congressaman from either North or South Carolina, who has single handedly said that he is trying to cut back on the largess that he and his fellow representatives get from the Federal Goverment. He knows that it is 'Day Light robbery', but how do you get any representative to vote less pay or benefits for themselves, when they control all the decision making power? It has not, for some strange and unexplained reason, not even being let come up to a committee vote? I guess they will have to live with being in higher and higher income ranges, thus having to pay more taxes? Oh that's right, they are standing firm that 3,200 individuals who make over a million dollars a year should not have to pay anymore, but 900,000 middle class tax payers is alright? What's wrong with that picture? (c) Lastly, and hot off today's press (11-12-11)is the news that the heads of money pits, Fannie Mae, and Freddie Mac, are receiving large bonuses on top of their $900,000.00+ dollar salaries!!!!!!!!!! The rationale by the Federal agency that oversees these organizations, is that they have to offer these large bonuses and incentives to attract the top talent.Tim Geithner, Secretary of the US Treasury, only makes $200K. I can see why they gave that explanation, It makes so much sense. So far, they have borrowed over $170,000,000,000.00 Billion and are back looking for more as of this past week. I guarantee, with no financial education, I could lose as much as they have and just hire a bright tax attorney to keep me from paying too much of my income, especially with all the friends that I'd have in the House of Representatives that think I should not pay one 'thin dime' extra money! I could create more jobs, like didn't happen from 2000 to 2008, unless I misunderstood the trickle down job creating theory?
This is the tip of the proverbial iceberg. Just with these three examples, is there anyone who makes less than a million dollars (middle class)not Get It as to why the Occupy Movement??

[farmrdave]

I have a favorable comment to make about the OWS protestors. They can and are unhappy about the state of affairs in our land. They can and are protesting. It is a legitimate beef they have because they have spent their lives (sheltered lives) learning in public school that they are entitled to this and entitled to that and as in each generation they reach a point and discover it is not all roses in the future and in this generation they are looking to the future and seeing that Congress and the WhiteHouse seem set on destroying any chance they have of advancement in this life. Only problem is that they are throwing stones (figuratively) at those in America who they consider wealthy. It is not wealthy people who are in the wrong in this case it is the public servants we have elected to congress and other government that has dropped the ball and has allowed all this to happen. It is a sad fact that persons make careers of public service. The idea of an elected Congress and President is they will be temporary and then return to their productive life after their term(s) are over. Today's reality is that winning a seat in congress is better than winning the lottery because you are guaranteed that all of your self and your families needs are paid for life. It is not a written law but it is a fact that you will be offered "side benefits" by lobbyists. You then have unlimited health care coverage, etc. For you OWS people who read this I ask that you direct your efforts toward something that will benefit all Americans instead of attacking anyone just because they are better of financially than you are. Look to the cause of the problem. Fire your Congressmen. If we replace them when they are not supporting our wishes soon we will be rid of the bad apples. Sincerely farmrdave in Orygun

[greenlantern1]

Remember when filthy "shock jock", Howard Stern, had U.S. Senator Alphonse D'Amato as a guest?
One of his sponsors was CLEAR CHANNELS.
When CLEAR CHANNELS went belly up, the American taxpayer bailed it out.
Now, CLEAR CHANNELS sponsors Rush Limbaugh.
Before it declared bankruptcy, GM paid a lot of money to Rush Limbaugh.
Did that junkie help to build ONE car?
Clifford Spencer

[YesPaul]

I never feel I am not entitled to the money the 1% makes; by the same token, people who makes significantly less than me is not entitled to my hard earned money either.

I am not into giving handouts to those who do not try hard and I do believe, if you better yourself, work diligently and smartly, you will be rewarded.

[greenlantern1]

It was Herbert Hoover, not FDR, who promised a chicken in every pot and a car in every garage.
Hoover, and his cronies, got rich from the Food For Belgium program.
Hoover vetoed the Bonus Bill that would hgave rewarded those that actually did go OVER THERE!
Clifford Spencer

[YesPaul]

Occupy Wall Street groups - do you have a job you need to go to? How do you find the time to protest? Are you getting paid to do this?

[greenlantern1]

Did Wall Street pay Rush Limbaugh?
Howard Stern?
Rupert Murdoch?
Bernard Madoff?
Conrad Black?
Clifford Spencer

[BuckeyeChuck]

Turns out FDR had it right we need to go back to a indexed income tax, high corporate taxes "which make them want to reinvest in their companies" and high capital gains tax on the super wealthy.

The US only grows when you have high taxes on the wealthiest Americans, look it up.

[twoedgedsword]

For the record - I don't disagree with the general sentiments of the Occupy crowd. It's the motivations and the shallowness of thought that result in looking in the wrong place(s) for answers.

[twoedgedsword]

Self examination has always proven more difficult than crying outwardly. This is what constitutes the protest and only media hype has promoted it to this level. Even so, the coverage will cease as the opportunity to cash in on it fades.

The "what people want' graph is a joke. Most people do not want to live their lives dedicated to gaining that much wealth. People want to chase their individualistic goals and TIME is finite. You can only spend so much time watching TV, working out, practicing piano, playing games, writing books, smoking dope, shooting hoops, feeding homeless..... yet still become rich.

If you want wealth, work for it - it's within your grasp. If you don't - and there are more important things in life then do THAT.

That graph is a joke - if this is what people really "want" then what they "want" is something for nothing. To have their cake and eat it to. I say - let those who are money hungry toil their lives away and sure I'll take some of those 'crumbs' - and I'll work for that too. But I'll also live me life pursuing thing more meaningful (to me) than how much is in my bank account.

At the end of the day - I do not envy those people. Even those who seem to have gotten a free ride. There IS no free ride.

That graph is a joke and the joke is on those marching around like fools. At the end of the day, what they are crying about is that the very thing they've been arguing for has turn out NOT to be what was good. That is embodied in the president of the United States. Sorry if that stings - but it is what it is. Income redistribution doesn't work when there are too many lazy mouths to feed. Eventually, people get pissed off and it's not the rich because they have. It's the folks in the middle (that supposedly doesn't exist). What the lazy mouth do is steal not money, but TIME.

[KnowerseekerReturns]

Entrepreneurs, CEOs, bankers, lawyers, and doctors are *not* the hardest working or most educated Americans.

[askagain]

KnowerseekerReturns - You may be right. But these people knew what they wanted, got the skills and education they needed, and dedicated their efforts to achieve their goals. Mt friend, that is not the easiest thing in the world to do. My son is a doctor. It took four years of college, four years of medical school, one year of internship, and four years of residency. If you don't think that took motivation, perserverance, endurance, and a strong work ethic, you are living in some other world. Once finished with his training, he worked very hard to build his practice. Not everyone is willing to pay the price but he so glad he did it.