Debate continues over role of waterboarding in gathering bin Laden intel

CBS/AP

Various accounts of the intelligence gathering that led to the death of Osama bin Laden gave rise to the suggestion on Monday that the mission to kill the al Qaeda leader was successful in part because of the "enhanced interrogation techniques" the U.S. used on some terrorism detainees.

Since then, however, the White House, some leaders in Congress and former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld have all played down the notion that waterboarding or other "enhanced" techniques aided the mission. At least one congressman, however -- Rep. Peter King (R-N.Y.) -- maintains that waterboarding helped.

"The fact is that no single piece of information led to the successful mission that occurred on Sunday," White House Press Secretary Jay Carney said in a press briefing Tuesday. Multiple detainees provided insights, Carney said, and those insights were "just a slice of information" intelligence analysts gathered and used to track bin Laden.

Carney said it was "simply strange... to suggest a piece of information that may or my not have been gathered eight years ago somehow led to a successful mission on Sunday."

He added that there has been "no change whatsoever" to President Obama's opposition to the use of enhanced interrogation techniques.

The question of the role such techniques played in this mission arose after the Associated Press reported that it was two key detainees -- Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and Abu Faraj al-Libi -- who gave American officials the nickname of a courier who ultimately led U.S. intelligence officials to bin Laden. The two detainees reportedly gave the information up at foreign CIA "black sites," where waterboarding occurred.

However, the AP fleshed out its report later in the day. Citing unnamed former officials, the AP wrote, "Mohammed did not discuss al-Kuwaiti while being subjected to the simulated drowning technique known as waterboarding... He acknowledged knowing him many months later under standard interrogation."

Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.), chair of the Senate Intelligence Committee, backed up the assertion today that waterboarding did not play a role in the sting against bin Laden.

"To the best of our knowledge based on a look, none of it came as a result of harsh interrogation practices," she said.

She added with respect to the usefulness of waterboarding -- a practice the U.S. historically considered to be torture: "I happen to know a good deal about how those interrogations were conducted, and in my view, nothing justifies the kind of procedures that were used."

Yet King, chair of the House Homeland Security Committee, maintains that his sources tell him waterboarding played a key role in the mission.

"The initial information on the courier was obtained by waterboarding back in 2003," King said on Fox News today. "I've spoken to people who are very familiar with the situation. They have first-hand information... I'm telling you that people who were on the ground, people who are in a position to know, they told me that."

U.S. intelligence officials told reporters Sunday night that they finally learned the courier's real name four years ago, years after learning his nickname from the detainees. As Wired's Spencer Ackerman points out, by that time, President Bush had already ceased waterboarding and shuttered the black sites, moving Mohammed, al-Libbi and other detainees to the prison at Guantanamo Bay.

In an interview Monday, Rumsfeld said that "no one was waterboarded at Guantanamo Bay."

"It is true that some information that came from normal interrogation approaches at Guantanamo did lead to information that was beneficial in this instance," he said with respect to the death of bin Laden. "But it was not harsh treatment and it was not waterboarding."

[abbe91]

The only time Bush might have had a clue about where bin Laden was is when he was treated for his kidney problems in a American hospital in Dubai just 2 months before 911.

[user000049586849302948603]

And some time after 9/11, both Bush and Rummey were saying that they didn't care where OBL was; it wasn't a priority for them.

[curse914]

by rhermes May 3, 2011 11:05 PM EDT
who cares what methods were used...
===================================

Anyone who cares about the rights inferred by Habeas Corpus and the Magna Carta.

There is a reason why Syria and Egypt had permanent states of emergency in place. So they could label anyone a "terrorist," and do as they felt without due process.

[smitvict]

Bush is responsible. That's what the liberal line is, so obviously enhanced interrogation techniques identified the courier and it was all downhill (though slowly) from them on. Bush gets credit.

[jimbom121]

Huh??? How is that?

[pasha128]

The Ticking Time Bomb scenario has become a stereotype for those that support waterboarding. In this scenario that ticking time bomb must have had a decade (10 year) long fuse. Somehow KSM must have been the sole source of critical information for that entire decade. Neither decade long scenario in this case is probable or even reasonable.

[pasha128]

Proponents of this theory are pitching a new show to FOX -- 24 Decades.

[user000049586849302948603]

Welcome to the 21st century; MRI barrels trump any argument that can be made for torture.

[bradkt1]

Probably...but so what? The information that they got appeared to be totally insignificant at that time and didn't add up right away. Without other information that was obtained via traditional methods of interrogation and analysis, it would have added up to nothing.

Many professiionals will tell you that a determined interrogator...given time...can get a lot more reliatble information through s atandard interrogation than through torture. People will tell you anything...including the truth...to try to get you to stop torturing them.

That does not mean that we should have used these methods. We still don't have a legal system that allows evidence obtained by enhanced interrogations that has passed legal muster. The military tribunals have been struck down twice by the Supreme Court...and we can't use this evidence in our federal courts either.

[rationall7]

What a reflection of the chaos durning the Bush years.

"The initial information on the courier was obtained by waterboarding back in 2003," King said on Fox News today

In an interview Monday, Rumsfeld said that "no one was waterboarded at Guantanamo Bay."


I'm not going to ask which is telling the truth but which one is the better lier?

[jvalles1963]

Wow, based on GOP crap, intellegence info from "water" boarding has a very LONG shelf life of 7 years!!!REALLY, if the info was soooo credible why didn't George W act upon it many years ago to capture and kill Osama Bin Laden???

"I don't know where he is NOR do I spend time thinking about him" GW 2002

[usadvisor101]

certain brainless cons are going to down play the fact that Obama took a much more aggressive approach, and actually told the pakistani govt,we will go after him in any country.bush did not,and he was fearful of the paki's response.everyone knew he was hiding in pakistan, I would think bush did too,but he relied on them to do it. now we know why his plan did not work! doesnt matter where the intel(even old!ha,ha,ha!) comes from if you are going to expect someone else to do the hard work.kinda like his blunder at tora bora..

[jedi0849]

Killing a unarmed man is ok but dumping water on them is a war crime. You guys are too funny for words.

I guess we should have just asked them for the info, I'm sure they would have just told us because they love the U.S so much!!!!

[rhermes]

who cares what methods were used...

[aintfakin]

torture is for cowards
Dick Cheney and George Bush are yellow bellied cowards
Dick Cheney never worked harder in his life to get 5 different deferments to the draft during the Vietnam war.
When he finally got to be VP under a feeble minded pres he had the power to start his own dirty little war with lies that he didnt have to fight in.

A democratic congressman helped Bush to the front of the national guard line where he would be safe from combat. That had the effect of pushing another poor joe at the end of the line into the war. I wonder if his name is on the wall.
What did bush do when he started the Iraq war? He sent almost the entire national guard over there.
In fact almost none of the lilly livered chikenhawks responsible for Iraq ever served. not Wolfowitz....not Rove.
That big tough radio blabbermouth Limbaugh dodged all the bullets with deferrment for a boil on his but.
and for all you brain dead pigs that worship these guys and slander John Kerry.....Kerry VOLUNTEERED for action.

[usadvisor101]

they were definately chicken hawks.wolfowitz was the biggest joke, next to zero tollerance -except rush, whom used his wealth and connections to avoid prison. yes,Kerry actually seen combat.

But I disagree.......I would give certain military units, when in times of national security,closed door sessions.

[aintfakin]

torture is for cowards
Dick Cheney and George Bush are yellow bellied cowards
Dick Cheney never worked harder in his life to get 5 different deferments to the draft during the Vietnam war.
When he finally got to be VP under a feeble minded pres he had the power to start his own dirty little war with lies that he didnt have to fight in.

A democratic congressman helped Bush to the front of the national guard line where he would be safe from combat. That had the effect of pushing another poor joe at the end of the line into the war. I wonder if his name is on the wall.
What did bush do when he started the Iraq war? He sent almost the entire national guard over there.
In fact almost none of the lilly livered chikenhawks responsible for Iraq ever served. not Wolfowitz....not Rove.
That big tough radio blabbermouth Limbaugh dodged all the bullets with deferrment for a boil on his but.
and for all you brain dead pigs that worship these guys and slander John Kerry.....Kerry VOLUNTEERED for action.