March 22, 2010 1:35 AM

Health Care Debate Shows Ideological Split

By
Mark Knoller
Topics
Health Care
(Credit: AP)
Nearly four hours of debate in the House of Representatives produced a partisan victory for President Obama and his party. But it also showed just how divided America is on health care and on the larger issue of the role of government.

The victory gives the Mr. Obama bragging rights that he delivered on his top domestic agenda campaign promise.

The Senate health care reform bill won final passage in the House by a narrow 219-212 majority. Republicans were quick to point out that Democrats were alone in voting for the bill. Only the opposition vote was bipartisan as 34 Democrats joined with all 178 Republicans in casting "no" votes against the measure.

As Democrats and Republicans alternated statements during the Sunday night debate, the health care bill was portrayed as either "historic" or "deeply flawed."

"It's a defining moment in our nation's history," said Rep. James Clyburn, D-SC. "This is the civil rights act of the 21st century."

But Rep. John Kline, R-MI., decried the bill as being full of backroom deals and the product of closed-door negotiations. "This bill is not what the American people want," he said. "They're imploring us to start over."

Democrats and Republicans both claimed to be hearing the true voices of the American people in defending their support for or opposition to the health care bill. And polls showed there were powerful voices on both sides of the issue.

Yet in the months leading up to the mid-term elections in November, President Obama will still have to make the case that the changes in health care coverage imposed by the bill are good for everyone.

(Credit: White House)
Out of sight of reporters, Mr. Obama exchanged high-fives and hugs with Vice-President Joe Biden and other senior advisors in the Roosevelt Room as they watched the health care bill win House approval.

In public, the President was careful not to appear to be gloating about his political triumph, but neither was he shy about trumpeting that this was a "momentous" day and that "we answered the call of history."

"This isn't radical reform," he insisted, while at the same time he was proud to declare "it is major reform."

It was his adopted bill that will soon be law and that means he's got new and expanded responsibility for the U.S. health care system. Some provisions won't take effect for years, and if Americans have complaints about their health coverage, they'll take them to the White House.

For that reason, even as Mr. Obama hailed the changes that will soon be in place, he tried to temper expectations.

"This legislation will not fix everything that ails our health care system," he said in his late night statement in the East Room, "but it moves us decisively in the right direction."

The American people will be able to register their assessment of the health care overhaul, when they elect the new Congress in November.

More Coverage of Health Care Reform:

House Passes Health Care Bill
Obama: "This is What Change Looks Like"
Health Care Vote: How Each Representative Voted
Announcement of the Vote
Boehner Tells Democrats: Shame on You
Pelosi Urges House to "Make History"
Health Care Bill: What's In It?
Short-Term Effect of the Bill
What, Me Worry? Obama Watches Basketball
Stupak Called "Baby Killer" for Backing Bill
CBSNews.com Special Report: Health Care

Mark Knoller is a CBS News White House correspondent. You can read more of his posts in Hotsheet here. You can also follow him on Twitter here: http://twitter.com/markknoller.


Add a Comment See all 45 Comments
by HAMMER77777 October 23, 2010 1:03 AM EDT
we should repeal this monstrocity...we dont need this bill.
hammer@live.com.ph
Reply to this comment
by neblotr April 15, 2010 1:46 PM EDT
Ok to the guy that said that the healthcare reform is "unconstitutional" please, without looking it up define the parameters by which something is deemed unconstitutional. I highly doubt you know, it's just one of those last resorts before you just give up completely, because you have been beaten to a pulp, and no longer have the strength to fight.

BTW to all you gun toting red-necks. The constitution clearly states "right to BARE arms" not weapons, this was a measure that resulted in what today is known as the T-shirt. This would have been a god-send in the time the constitution was written, they wore only clothes that cover the entire body INCLUDING THEIR ARMS. Most of the clothes were made out of wool, or thick cotton. Can you imagine what it would have been like in the summer time, itchy, chafing, sweaty, fat guys that would love to have BARE ARMS
how it could have ever been mistaken for right to posses and carry guns is beyond me
Reply to this comment
by HAMMER77777 October 23, 2010 1:01 AM EDT
you are completelymistaken..we have the second ammendment...this health care bill is unconstitutional and we dont want it or need it
by mrs_mamacow April 2, 2010 1:57 AM EDT
KUDOS TO THE HEALTHCARE REFORM!

Where are your hearts people? The passing of this bill is huge, it's historic and it stands to bring up to light and for debate a whole slew of BAD, bad businesses/industries. It's about time because you know who you are and you know what you do... There's a lot of trembling knees out there--waiting to get busted, to get shut down, or to get put on a leash. Hooray, because it's about time!

WILL ALL OF THE NAY-SAYERS PLEASE STAND UP?
Come on, let the people get a better look at you so we can put a face on GREED and to those who perpetuate unethical and abusive business practices, and to those who will allow the unfortunate sick people and innocent children and their families to be stranded on the wayside of this broken system to suffer and possibly die or endure disabilities as a result of inadequate or lack of medical treatment.

Have a heart because shame on you!

So much good is to come out of this healthcare reform. We should not be fighting to revoke this bill. We should talk about how to make it better--because MORE GOOD can come of it.

This reform allows us to now take a closer look at our nation's healthcare system, OPEN OUR EYES to it's injustices and failings, shed light on the malpractices (and anticipate possible future ones) of insurance companies (those offering healthcare coverage and those offering malpractice coverage), drug companies, hospitals, physician's offices, malpractice lawyers, food industry too... there is much corruption and bad businesses to be seen and it's about time it gets regulated because they've shown no mercy to the people's best interests, no mercy to the sick, no mercy to the innocent children... they've violated our trust, our health, our rights... they've put MONEY BEFORE PEOPLE/LIVES and that they've shown that there's no limit to GREED.

Shame on you.
Reply to this comment
by HAMMER77777 October 23, 2010 1:01 AM EDT
im a nay-Sayer..i dont like this bill and we should repeal it...write me at hammer@live.com.ph to debate this
by erasmus111 March 22, 2010 2:40 PM EDT
by lovethiscountry March 22, 2010 12:06 PM EDT
I understand you would like to live in socialist country.


So you are saying that because everyone has health care, that makes a
"socialist" country?

You need to get a grip on reality.
Reply to this comment
by HAMMER77777 October 23, 2010 1:02 AM EDT
yes that is socialist..in Capitalism....if u want something, you get it yourself..the government doesn't provide it to you
by lovethiscountry March 22, 2010 2:23 PM EDT
My point is, we cannot afford this bill at this time. The blame game goes to everyone in Washington . . . not just the Republicans!

So you don't agree with me and I do not agree with you BUT neither has anything to do with the unconstitutional Healthcare Reform Bill and its cost.

Actually I doubt if you care as you just have your fun blogging your anti-republican, anti-capitalism rhetoric.
Reply to this comment
by lakota2012 March 22, 2010 1:45 PM EDT
lovethiscountry: "rising taxes on everything"
---------------------



Obviously, you're equating rising state and local taxes or costs on goods to more than just the economic downturn, since federal income taxes are actually the same since the TWO bush tax cuts of 2001/2003. Some states are much worse than others, but I definitely believe it was the bushevik deregulation, lack of oversight and lack of accountability that allowed the financial sector to game the system.

Try reading the #1 bestseller right now, "The Big Short: Inside the Doomsday Machine," by Michael Lewis, to see exactly how the bond sector gamed the system and how they are doing it yet again, since we still do not have financial reform to protect the average citizen.
Reply to this comment
by lovethiscountry March 22, 2010 12:06 PM EDT
It seems you only answered one of my question. We are 70 and still working because we can't afford to quit due to rising taxes on everything which will continue to go up for all of us (not for just those making over $250,000) because our State, County, Town and Schools are going broke. The costs for the health care expenses added to our State will make them have to keep increasing taxes.

What did I say that has anything to do with "so your political rhetoric is just showing the sickness by the rabid rightwad propagandists". I don't believe my questions have anything to do with political rhetoric but more with wanting answers.

I understand you would like to live in socialist country. But remember, over half of this country does not.

If you cannot answer the rest of my questions, but answer with more nasty commits, I will assume you are being paid by an organization to just write these nasty blogs.
Reply to this comment
by lakota2012 March 22, 2010 1:31 PM EDT
lovethiscountry: "I understand you would like to live in a socialist country."
------------------



Nah....you're just inserting your partisan ideology between the lines, since people like you have been getting all the one-sided propaganda from the FAUX NoNooz bozos, which try to paint the Dem Congress and President Obama as "marxists" and "socialists" on every broadcast just like the limbaw lemmings. BTW, how's your SOCIALIST MEDICARE? Quite hilarious how the majority of all the teabaggin' fools are old, white guys on Medicare!

The bush/cheney Great Recession has more to do with your state going broke than anything else -- certainly not this HCR bill which taxes the top 2% -- obviously not you! With health care costs spiraling out of control, and as our population ages with 80 million baby boomers retiring over the next 2 decades, how can we continue to let the for-profit insurance mafia skim a full 30% off the top without providing any health care? Medicare has a 3% -- not 30% overhead -- and this HCR bill is targeting the waste, fraud and abuse of the system to make it more efficient.

I don't have time to answer all your questions, but there are plenty of websites that can answer them with facts, instead of the usual LIES and DECEPTIONS by those on FAUX NoNooz or rush limbaw, paid to entertain you by corporate America.

Just like drama queen miNOrity leader boner last night, all his speech contained was political rhetoric, since the majority of small businesses have fewer than 50 employees, so it is the mid-sized and mega-sized companies that will be required to pay for health care -- most of which already do. It is the small business owners and individuals that cannot find affordable health care like you have on Medicare.

Just think, with another 32 million Americans with health care, there will be less strain on the hospital's E.R., since most that cannot afford health care are using the E.R. as their primary physician, and being diagnosed much later than they should, which is why we rank so low (19th or last among the top industrialized countries) in preventable disease, and also the $1,500 surcharge on those that have insurance to pay for those that do not, will eventually disappear.

Unfortunately, you just don't see how the bush "trickle-down" economic lunacy and cutting taxes for the wealthiest Americans while trying to fight TWO WARS with an expanded military/industrial complex, and then passing Medicare Part D has put us in the bind we are in today, since nothing during bushworld was ever paid-for! Then, by doubling the national debt to $11 Trillion, we are paying $1 Billion per day on the interest alone -- certainly not Obama's fault. We currently have yet another jobless recovery like the 2001 bush recession, but that is more to do with the global economy and offshoring of jobs by corporate America over the past 30 years. We just didn't notice it so much during the boom years of the 90's when 22 million jobs were created here, but certainly started noticing it in 2001 to the present.

Of course I realize that this HCR bill doesn't provide free health care (but that's what the talking heads at FAUX NoNooz say) but it's the middle, working class that's hurting today. The average family makes about $45,000 per year, which makes $8,000+ per individual health care costs UNAFFORDABLE, but this HCR bill will subsidize those making less than $88,200 per year on a sliding scale, and offer much more competitive rates through exchanges for small businesses and individuals. There is absolutely no competition now, nor any reason why the for-profit insurance mafia cannot deny coverage or drop their insured when they get sick --- until today!

Personally, Medicare for all would cut out all the for-profit insurance mafia that provide NO HEALTH CARE, and cut costs tremendously by making the system more efficient. Instead of asking so many questions, try Googling "CONCIERGE CARE" which is stealing more physicians from the system for the wealthy VIP treatment, and check administrative/billing costs between Canada and the U.S., where you will find that 12 employees in Canada do the same job that requires 400-500 in U.S. hospitals. Talk about cost savings!!!!!
by lakota2012 March 22, 2010 11:58 AM EDT
lovethiscountry: "this is a fact"
----------------------




GEEZ.....you conservitards are always attacking lawyers, yet that is where you're information comes from! HA!...HA!...HA!...ROTFLMFAO!!!

Apparently, with your incessant questions about this health care bill, YOU have never read it just like all the other republiCONS, and can only spew the usual political rhetoric from the FAUX NoNooz propagandists!

Get over it.....although I see the need for some form of SP-UHC in the future like all the rest of the industrialized countries in the world that have far better health care than the U.S. at 37th, at least we now have some form of health care reform that regulates the for-profit insurance mafia a little bit, despite their continued skimming of 30% right off the top of the $2.5 Trillion health care debacle now!
Reply to this comment
by lakota2012 March 22, 2010 11:49 AM EDT
lovethis country: "can you afford higher taxes?"
--------------------------




We make far less than the $250,000 limit that this bill will tax by 3.8%, and I'm willing to bet YOU make far less as well, so your political rhetoric is just showing the sickness by the rabid rightwad propagandists!

The top 2% of Americans will see their taxes increased for this health care bill -- not you -- not me -- and besides, those making $10 Million in income presently, pay a mere 19% in realized income tax, so cry me a river for those wealthiest Americans paying less in taxes than the middle or working classes!
Reply to this comment
by lakota2012 March 22, 2010 11:42 AM EDT
douloscross: "I am opposed to the costs of this bill...back room deals.."
------------------------




Give us all a break, since just like miNOrity leader boner proved last night with his melodramatic speech, the republiCONS never read this bill and only had a need to spew their political rhetoric with their twisted ideas of what they "thought" was in the bill -- hardly the facts!

Apparently, you're against deficit reduction like the rest of the moronic republiCONS, since the non-partisan CBO rated this bill as reducing the deficit by over $1.3 Trillion over the next 20 years, and paying for it by raising taxes on the top 2% by a mere 3.8% -- the wealthiest that have been paying far less and doing the best due to the bush tax cuts.

As far as back room deals go, there has been no legislation by either party that didn't have back room deals, so that is a no starter! I particularly liked the arm-twisting and extending vote from 3 AM to 6 AM that the GOP did in 2005 to pass Medicare Part D gift to BIG PHARMA -- another multi-TRILLION DOLLAR debacle that has added $19 Trillion in unfunded future liabilities -- much worse than this HCR bill that the CBO says will reduce our deficits!

Where is your concern over the bigger costs of Medicare Part D?
Reply to this comment
by kodiak8881 March 22, 2010 11:56 AM EDT
lakota2012 - If your tag, Lakota, is connected to the Native American tribe, the Lakota's, then you already know what happens when big brother takes over your lives and your future. Once a proud and strong Indian nation, the Lakota's, like most tribes, have been reduced to dependent surfs. Big brother took away your freedom, moved you to reservations, and said he would take care of you. What happened to that strong, independent nation? Obamacare.
by lakota2012 March 22, 2010 12:04 PM EDT
Hey kodiak8881, thanks for the convoluted conservitard history lesson, but Lakota2012 has nothing to do with the Indian tribe, like all the rest, which were devastated by the white man -- much like the racist, senile, old man's country club party of republiCONS, or the teabaggin' fools.

Why do you conservitards hate minorities so much, despite being one of the 19-percenters in America today?
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