A "fiscal cliff" Christmas?

Signs of progress for the "fiscal cliff" negotiations came to a screeching halt on Wednesday when House Speaker John Boehner signaled that he and the White House remain far apart, ultimately warning his fellow lawmakers that they might have to work through the Christmas holidays.

Boehner told his fellow Republicans Wednesday not to make plans for Christmas, CBS News has learned, and members said there were no indications from Boehner's remarks that any real progress has been made between the two chief negotiators involved in the process: Boehner and President Obama.

• Boehner to House GOP: Don't make Christmas plans
• Complete coverage: The "fiscal cliff"

As behind-the-scenes talks continue, Republicans say publicly that the president's latest proposal, which includes $1.4 trillion - down from $1.6 trillion - in tax revenue is still far more than they are willing to swallow. The only GOP proposal that has been made public so far would cut $900 billion in spending and raise $800 billion in revenues, which would be achieved by closing unspecified loopholes and deductions rather than increasing rates.

Boehner cast Mr. Obama's plan as "mainly tax hikes" and said it "does not meet the two standards that I laid out the day after the election." The key question, however, is whether or not Boehner is actually open to the idea of raising any rates at all. Despite recent openness by some Republicans to do so, and hints from Boehner that the wealthy will have to pay more under a "fiscal cliff" deal, White House press secretary Jay Carney said today there's "no indication yet" Boehner is currently on that page.

Meantime, Politico reports that Boehner might not be wedded to the $800 billion revenue number in his proposal, though that alone is not likely to break the logjam in the negotiations:

House Speaker John Boehner privately told President Barack Obama that he's prepared to consider more than the $800 billion the GOP has already proposed in new tax revenues -- but only if the White House will back much deeper cuts to entitlement programs, according to several sources familiar with the talks.

Getting beyond $800 billion in revenue without raising tax rates on upper-income families would be difficult. Obama has long demanded that marginal income rates go up on the top 2 percent of Americans.

But for the time being, Boehner's private concession might not be the breakthrough the fiscal talks need. The White House has been resistant to additional entitlement savings -- their proposal has been stuck at $600 billion, and their revenue target is pegged at $1.4 trillion. Republicans insist a revenue increase that large could never pass the House or Senate

A new poll reveals what other recent polls have shown: Americans want compromise. They support what many Republicans do not: making the wealthy pay a higher tax rate to help avoid the "cliff." Additionally, the poll from the Wall Street Journal and NBC indicates that entitlement cuts aren't off the table for Americans, although the Democrats are steadfastly against that idea.

About two-thirds of Americans of all political stripes would like Congress to strike a deal to reduce the federal budget deficit, even if means cutting Social Security and Medicare and boosting some tax rates, the survey released Wednesday found.

An even larger share--more than three-quarters of Americans, including 61% of Republicans--said they would accept raising taxes on the wealthy in order to avoid a "fiscal cliff" of large spending cuts and tax increases now set to take place in January.

[indisputablysane]

An elegant, concrete, simple solution to our FISCAL PROBLEM (but not easy to get congress to enact):
28th constitutional amendment= Yearly Balanced Budget Required

Balanced definition:
Debt to GDP ratio
>35% = balanced
<35% = allow 10% extra yearly spending

The beauty is that congress can be bypassed:The Constitution provides that an amendment may be proposed either by the Congress with a two-thirds majority vote in both the House of Representatives and the Senate or by a constitutional convention called for by two-thirds of the State legislatures.
It will take only one state to get the ball rolling!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[5crows]

Let them spend Christmas in jail, without pay. They need to stare at walls and figure out what is important.

[WhereisOT]

(norquist expresses no discomfort at the moral impact of his project - providing tax favors for the wealthy that are paid for by cutting services to those who truly need them. "I understand greed and envy," norquist says. "The idea that somebody's making money and you want to steal some of it? That's an interesting idea. But it's not morality. It's certainly not justice")

Quite the joke emperor for the joke republican party...

[WhereisOT]

"Where does he get his money? ... Who is he slave to? ... How does he terrify people?" (Senator Alan Simpson) concerning the money laundering joke norquist....

"It's a different Republican Party now. The modern Republican Party"
Guess to the white collar criminal norquist, heavy is the head that wears the crown...

[Rick_Carter1]

"UNCLE SAM" IS BLEEDING TO DEATH, EVERYONE !!!

I have been harping on this critical issue for many years now, but sadly the American people were just never interested in trying to stop this major hemorrhaging of our U.S. economy. "Uncle Sam" has basically been bleeding to death, but tragically no one seemed to care, and for the life of me I could never figure out why without taking into account the seductive influence of these program "End Time" Abrahamic religions. This hemorrhaging of the U.S. economy has been going on every month of every year for 3 1/2 decades now, but still no one is doing anything to keep the U.S. economy from basically bleeding to death. If any of you doubt what I am telling you, then please visit this link below which I have already personally shared with everyone so many countless times before. This massive hemorrhaging of the U.S. economy was always so very easy to prevent in the first place. - Rick Carter

http://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/balance/c0004.html

[Rick_Carter1]

(Sadly, the American people still cannot make the connection as this massive imbalance of trade impacts this country's current economic woes. This massive trade imbalance represents a very grave shortfall in national income, and the government earns revenue from this national income, which in turn goes to fund all of our government programs and obligations. This is really Economics 101, people, and every person basically has to live by the very same rules on a personal level as well, so no one really has any excuse for not knowing this. When you don't balance income with expenditures, you have more money going out than you have coming in. and this in turn forces you to borrow money if you want to maintain your economic standing in the world. For decades now the U.S. government has been forced to increasingly borrow and print more and more money in order to keep the U.S. economy inflated and fund all of their government programs and liabilities. But just like you or I have a limit to how much money we can personally borrow and spend, the U.S. government also has a limit to how much money they can borrow and print in order to head off economic and fiscal disaster. Please understand that the jobs and businesses in this country have a tendency to just naturally go where the money goes, and for 3 1/2 decades this money has been massively flowing out of the United States thanks to this never ending massive U.S. trade imbalance. Just since 1989, the U.S. has suffered over a $9.8 TRILLION trade imbalance in goods with the rest of the world, and still the U.S. just goes on massively hemorrhaging every month of every year to the tune of 3/4 TRILLION DOLLARS A YEAR, and to this very day this whole issue of trade imbalance still remains a non-issue in U.S. national elections. Apparently the American people just don't care, because I know I have been publicly harping on this issue for decades now. I have told them repeatedly that you can never, never, NEVER turn the U.S. economy around until you finally fix this MASSIVE U.S. trade deficit with the rest of the world, but it just goes in one ear and out the other. All of this was so extremely easy to prevent in the first place, simply by installing balanced trade stipulations and regulatory mechanisms into our international Free Trade agreements, designed to keep our trade with other countries in proper balance. It is the first rule or law of cybernetics, the science of feedback, that all complex systems need some kind of regulation if they are not to become unbalanced and unstable, and eventually self destruct. I have been harping on this issue offline and online ever since the early 1980s, sadly to virtually no avail. No one in this country seems to care that Uncle Sam is basically bleeding to death.

Oh, well, just like "The Highest National and World Security Issue", no one can ever say I didn't try to enlighten the American people. An enlightened electorate is absolutely essential for the survival of democracy, but from everything I can tell the majority of American people just aren't interested in the survival of democracy anymore, what they want is our entire world to go to hell in a hand basket, so their beloved Lord and Savior King Jesus can supposedly make his second advent into our world, to set up his future totalitarian theocratic kingdom over our entire world, and perpetually rule and reign as the supreme demigod dictator over our everyone and everything. What else can I possibly say to everyone anymore but have fun with your program "End Times"!) - Rick Carter

[cntrygirl3]

It has become painfully obvious that Mr. Boehner's oath to Norquist is far more important to him than his oath to America. Who does he think he is saying Obama hasn't met HIS terms. He hasn't met Obama's terms either. Mr. Boehner you folks lost the country even most Republicans think you should let those tax rates rise. What exactly are you doing. You lose which ever way it goes. So please don't give in because the fiscal cliff is really what is best for the country in the long run.

BUSH TAX CUTS MUST DIE!!!!!

[darkhorseky]

The cliff?
We been hanging on to the edge for 4 years now. Leadership after 4 years has to quit making excusses. Go ahead and tax the holleywood rich, the rock rich and the rich elite. Its a fairy tale anyway take from the rich and give to the poor. Most of them have thier money in other counties. Crap most of them live in other countries. No tax collection there. Now how about we give more to welfare. Lets see free food, free medical, free housing and lets not forget free cell phones. But not a system of getting them off welfare. How about we subsidize poor lower workers for corpations to work them and not pay them for a good wage. Of course we need cheap burgers, food, construction and grass cutters. So those that have worked hard to get ahead and the old people on fixed incomes will pay the price of anorther fairy tale. Free health care. Folks if you think this is not going to cost all of us that can't let or put our money off shore. Your dreaming.

[darkhorseky]

Nope, Just when any President is in office, I expect leadership from them. So why am I suppost to not expect this President to lead instead od hearing excusses.That has been in leadership for the past four years.

[drunk_dan]

Think4times replies: Dan is mainly jealous because he isn't as funny as me :)
____________________________
Actually, they are both funny, but we laugh WITH you Think! LOL

[drunk_dan]

Apu, apparently YOU haven't realized you LOST the last election. A majority of Americans REJECTED your fanatacism. Until your party realizes this and purges the insane members from the party, and moves back toward the middle, you will continue to lose elections. But please proceed. Keep showing everyone just how radical your party has become. Any form of coherent thought pattern has escaped the wing nuts.

[Rafterman11]

Exactly. I'm not saying Obama or the Dems are perfect. They also do stuff that pizzes me off. But its hilarious that the GOP continues to make the EXACT SAME mistakes, the EXACT SAME rhetoric, the EXACT SAME excuses, even though they got spanked in the last election and its obvious to EVERYONE, except them, why they got spanked.

[drunk_dan]

Exactly Rafter. I agree 100%.

[drunk_dan]

Rafterman11 replies: Keeping the poor poor? I thought you 'cons said Obama wanted income redistribution? Now he's not for it? So, which is it?
______________________
That depends Rafter. What did Rush tell them they should think today??? LOL