Fraud proof scarce in two voter ID cases

(CBS News) In September 2004, Terrence Hines appeared to register voters in the city of Florence, S.C., at a fast pace. Paid for each completed card by the South Carolina Progressive Network, Hines submitted 1,800 registrations. But it turned out that the signatures were forged. One easy clue for election officials was that Hines had signed up Frank Willis, who was then the town's mayor.

"He wasn't the sharpest knife in the drawer," said Florence County Solicitor Ed Clements, who referred Hines's case to state investigators.

Hines pleaded guilty to voter fraud charges in 2006. His is one of only three documented cases of voter fraud convictions in South Carolina going back to 2000, according to a CBS News review of the public record and interviews with election officials.

The state cited the Hines case in a legal brief filed in U.S. District Court in Washington, D.C., where the Palmetto State sued the U.S. Justice Department for blocking implementation of its photo voter ID law passed last year. A three-judge panel heard closing oral arguments this week.

The South Carolina case and a parallel case in a Pennsylvania state court, which wrapped its arguments Thursday in Harrisburg, are the focal points of a legal battle across the country.

While 10 states adopted new photo voter ID laws in the past two years, the laws are in legal limbo in six of them. In addition to Pennsylvania, where a group of voters represented by civil rights groups are seeking a preliminary injunction to block the law this November, a Wisconsin law is also tied up in court.

A three-judge panel in the Washington federal court found last month the new Texas photo voter ID law "imposes strict, unforgiving burdens on the poor, and racial minorities in Texas are disproportionately likely to live in poverty."

New laws in Alabama and Mississippi await Justice Department review. Laws passed in Rhode Island and New Hampshire won't take effect until after 2012. The only two states with new photo voter ID laws in effect are in Kansas and Tennessee.

Eight other states previously passed these laws, starting with Indiana, which passed Constitutional muster with the U.S. Supreme Court.

While the legal battles focus on the burden or ease with which voters may obtain the IDs, the justification for the laws has been preventing election fraud. Yet typically, as in South Carolina, the evidence of voter fraud is scarce and almost never involves voters impersonating others, the type of fraud photo IDs best address.

Voter ID law issues highlighted in S.C.
S.C. pushing for voting photo I.D. requirement

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[nimbleswitch]

WHAT!!?? CBS, what were you thinking? This was not "voter ID fraud" at all. It isn't even "voter fraud." It was vote REGISTRATION fraud--an entirely different thing.

Voter fraud is when someone fraudulently votes. The victims of voter fraud are the candidates and the people who voted properly. Fraudulent voting didn't happen here, nor was it even a threat to happen.

This here was vote registration fraud. That's when someone registers fictitious voters. The victims of vote registration fraud are the companies who pay these jerks to register voters and the tax payers to have to pay registrars to deal with this. That is why paying vote registration workers by the piece instead of by the hour is illegal in some states. But, believe it or not, the fictitious voters don't actually show up to vote--they don't even know about it.

This has nothing whatever to do with voter ID fraud, which is a rare and separate matter entirely: "Out of the 197 million votes cast for federal candidates between 2002 and 2005, only 40 voters were indicted for voter fraud, according to a Department of Justice study outlined during a 2006 Congressional hearing. Only 26 of those cases, or about .00000013 percent of the votes cast, resulted in convictions or guilty pleas." (http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/voter-fraud-real-rare/story?id=17213376#.UJUPcRxJtbk)

[todaypost]

Let's face it, this voter ID law is just a smoke screen to discourage voter participation. If GOP is really intended to improve the voter ID, GOP should use the money that were spent to commit the voter registration fraud to help voter getting ID.

[Red_Ranger12]

This is a ridiculous comment. Requiring ID to vote does not discourage voter participation, and you saying it does won't make it true. Photo ID is required for flying, opening bank accounts, getting a job, buying alcohol, getting into bars and clubs and who knows how many other things. Anyone who wants to vote is either not a citizen, extremely old, or not a part of society. If you want a special exemption for individuals over 80, I could understand, but to say that any of these individuals cannot get or provide ID is asinine.

[marychgo]

Isn't it strange that the Republican trolls on this thread are ignoring the subject of the story and bringing out all their long-since-debunked complaints that you can't live in the modern USA without a photo ID?

The NEWS STORY you're allegedly commenting is about how a GOP consulting firm, hired by the Republican Party of Florida, produced PRECISELY the same kind of voter REGISTRATION fraud that justified your hysteria about ACORN. They hired people to gather signatures, and one or two of them took shortcuts to get a paycheck. Surprise, surprise!

Meanwhile, you all REALLY need to figure out that some Americans do NOT share your lifestyle. You drive, so of course you have a photo ID, but millions of Americans DON'T drive. You buy booze and cigarettes, so you need a photo ID, but millions of Americans DON'T buy booze or cigarettes. You have credit cards or frequently cash checks, so you need a photo ID, but millions of Americans DON'T have credit cards or cash checks. The world just isn't as simple as you want to believe it is!

[GOP-R--Con-Men]

Republicans know all of that which is the very reason they passed these laws. The laws in fact are not about protecting the integrity of the vote. It's all about VOTER SUPRESSION of likely Democratic voter, pure and simple. The question is whether voter will punish or reward them for shredding the constitutional rights of fellow Americans.

[Red_Ranger12]

Why do you have to be a Republican troll to make comments on a CBS news article? Let's clear some things up, not having and ID is not possible if you are a part of American society. You cannot buy or rent a home or get a job without a photo ID. The idea that someone doesn't have one and cannot get one is ridiculous. Maybe you could start a lib charity to get people IDs instead of spending all of the legal dollars your party is using to fight in favor of voter fraud. As far as the title of the article goes, it does not talk about "fraud proof" being scarce much in the article. How do you get proof with no checks in place to ensure it isn't happening? We have seen multiple cases of registration fraud with plenty of proof, but there is no way to determine the amount of voter fraud occurring at the vote since there isn't any ID required. The only reason you oppose the law is to allow your party to keep committing fraud. What percent of American citizens do you think don't have a photo ID? I would put money on it being less than .1% of all Americans over 18. As far as registered voters, I would say even smaller.

[USisforallraces]

GOPs secret weapon = Strategic Allied Consulting!!!

Dems. have to be very very vigilant/ready for |GOPs election day fraud/sabotage!!.

[LosAngelesCA]

We are always told that voter turnout is low so how in the world is there fraud?

[LosAngelesCA]

We are always told that voter turnout is low so how in the world is there fraud?

[thechooch1]

The republicans know that there are more Democrats than republicans in the voter rolls. So if you don't have enough voters to defeat the Democrats, the next best thing is to try and limit the number of people that can vote Democratic. The republicans have found out that many poor and minority voters don't have picture IDs. Hence the voter ID laws to limit opposition. There is no history of any election being "thrown" due to voter fraud, just a red herring.

[Red_Ranger12]

The ***** is a political hack. Trying to pass the idea that "the Republicans have found out that many poor and minority voters don't have picture IDs." Where is the evidence of this? Can anyone present more than 3 people who fit this mold? And somehow the "problem" in Democrats eyes is that someone won't get to vote. Here's an idea, instead of spending money trying to fight the voter ID laws, spend that money on getting IDs for the handful of non-participants in society that do not have them. There is no history of elections being thrown because there are no statistics to look at on vote fraud. It's not a red herring, it's common sense and Dems don't have any.

[sandiegopete]

Voter fraud has never had any effect on any election in the United States. Numerous studies by both liberal and conservative groups have failed to identify a single case where voter fraud influenced any election. Voter fraud is a non-issue made up by right wing politician who do not think all citizens should be able to vote. The right wing believes only property owners should have a right to vote.


The right wingers continue to push the notion that voting in the United States is a privilage. They are dead wrong. Voting in the United States is a right. Once you start chipping away at that right you have started on the path to oligarchy. If you don't stand up and fight for your right to vote you deserve to lose that right. And the right wingers would be happy to take that away.

[tsigili]

Not so scarce. The instances of Democratic Party fraud are quite more common than the Democratic Party media, would have the people believe.

They are trying to brain wash the public, so the people won't challenge them......in spite of the common sense fact, that there is absolutely NOTHING WRONG with requiring valid voter ID, to prevent FRAUD, and to prevent illegal immigrants, from voting.

The Democratic Party media, are simply trying to brain wash people into believing that disenfranchises voters, and that is patently FALSE!

[sandiegopete]

First you make an ID law. Then you make the ID difficult to get for certain groups. Now you have established a legal method of restricting voting rights. Next you impose additional requirements. Eventually you will have reduced the eligable electorate to a small group of select voters. A journey of a thousand miles begins with the first step. This is the first step to eliminating democracy in America.

[thechooch1]

tsigili what a bunch of smelly BS! "The instances of Democratic Party fraud are quite more common". OK you made the fact less charge, how about substantiating it with some proof. Yep, didn't think you had any. How about the Faux News, no instances there either.

[mollydtt]

The unfortunate problem is that people with picture id's will go to the polls to vote, only to find that *that* particular photo id isn't valid for voting.
I can cash a check with my university issued photo id, but to vote, I'd need a passport, gun permit, or driver's license/DPS id.
My passport has expired, and I don't have a gun permit, but I do have a DPS id.
I "guess" I can vote.