Interview With ALF Cell Member

By: Daniel Schorn

BRADLEY: It's hard for some people to imagine, I mean people can imagine fighting for their freedom or even fighting for someone else's freedom but a lot of people can't understand fighting for the freedom of animals. I mean forever man has domesticated, killed animals for subsistence.

ALF CELL LEADER: We also know that some of the greatest thinkers of our time have refused to hurt animals. Some have chosen to hurt animals. Some chose to hurt, others, not. I chose not to hurt animals.

BRADLEY: But you could make the argument that raising animals, domesticating animals for your own survival is a natural state of things? Would you accept that argument?

ALF CELL LEADER: I don't accept that the commodification of life is natural. I don't accept that rampant heart disease is natural, the rates of asthma in the cities have gone up and that 13 year old girls are growing breast because of the hormones that are in their food. That is not natural…

BRADLEY: So in some places where people still live in what we would call a primitive society, you see tribesman into the water off their island homes with a spear and stand there looking for a fish and then kill that fish, and that's food for him and his family. That's not natural?

ALF CELL LEADER: I can't speak to what I don't know. At the same time there's a difference between eating to survive and commodifying life. There is a difference between commodification and surviving to live.

BRADLEY: And when you say commodifying what do you mean by that?

ALF CELL LEADER: I think it becomes a lot easier to exploit when you turn something into a commodity… when you objectify something it's easy to exploit. By commodification, we live in a society that discards life for money.

BRADLEY: Do you know Jerry Vlasak. You know who he is? Calls himself a spokesperson for the cause, for your cause. And he says it's time to start killing people who do research on animals?

ALF CELL LEADER: Well, we appreciate that he likes to consider himself a spokesperson, but he doesn't operate with our endorsement or our support or our appreciation, the support of the ALF. We have a strict code of non-violence. Not a single human being in the 20 to 30 year history has ever been harmed in an ALF action…. That's not luck, it's a pretty good record.

BRADLEY: I mean there are some cases, for example Daniel Andres San Diego is suspected of carrying out three bombings. One of which he set a bomb to go off an hour after the first bomb. Fortunately for the first responders, they spotted that second bomb and disarmed it. If they hadn't, they would have been hurt. I'd say that was lucky for them?

ALF CELL LEADER: I don't have much knowledge of specifics of the case.

BRADLEY: Does Dr. Vlasak speak for anyone the movement?

ALF CELL LEADER: I don't know who put Dr. Vlasak in the position he's in. It wasn't us, the ALF.

BRADLEY: He says that every social movement eventually resorts to violence. Would you agree with that?

ALF CELL LEADER: I think looking at history, many social movements have resorted to violence.

BRADLEY: And do you think that yours will resort to violence?

ALF CELL LEADER: As I said before, we don't choose the methods. We don't choose the weapons. We liberate life, destroy property. We have guidelines of non-violence.

BRADLEY: If you destroy my property, that's violence against me.

ALF CELL LEADER: Our intention is not to coerce, not to terrorize, not to threaten individuals. But I do believe that myself and the warriors I've worked with have saved countless lives… I've saved dogs and puppies that have lived their whole lives in a cage and released them to run around in a field and the dirt for the first time. If that's violent, then fine. If taking puppies out and letting them roam. And I believe every one of those lives has value. If that's violent, fine.

BRADLEY: What about Daniel Andreas San Diego, who is suspected of carrying out three bombings in California, and threatening people's lives. What do you think of his actions?

ALF CELL LEADER: [No answer.]

BRADLEY: But he [San Diego] set off a nail bomb, and he threatened to car-bomb or shoot the president of a big company that does tests on animals… Isn't that pretty much what Jerry Vlasak is advocating?

ALF CELL LEADER: I've never made [a] delineation between a bomb as being violent or a milk jug filled with kerosene as violent. I don't know what to say…. We have put the lives of a security guard above the lives of hundreds of animals. It's a judgment call, an ethical dilemma. We don't claim to have all the answers.

BRADLEY: You do see, from your perspective that the life of one man is worth more than the life of dozens of animals?

ALF CELL LEADER: I can't say that I cannot say one mans life has more value than hundreds of animals… because operating under ALF guidelines we never harmed life. A 30 year history of never harming a human being.

BRADLEY: Is there a place where you draw the line. I mean, is there a line between non-violence and violence?

ALF CELL LEADER: We don't throw bricks at people. We don't set people on fire, buildings when there are people inside. We don't assault people when we carry out actions.

BRADLEY: You say that violence against a building, destroying a building is not violence. So what I'm wondering is how do you get from non-violence to violence?

ALF CELL LEADER: If a human being is injured, it cannot be an ALF or ELF action. By virtue of the guidelines, it's not an ALF action.

BRADLEY: So you came here to say to us tonight that the ALF, the ELF are non-violent and will not escalate beyond arson. Is that right?

ALF CELL LEADER: I think it interesting that in today's political climate, that we are America's top domestic terrorist threat; but, we haven't killed anyone. But the neo-Nazis have maimed and have murdered and they're not considered a terrorist threat. I think it's abysmal. Animal activists can face more time than a man who rapes a woman, I think it's because it challenges the status quo.

BRADLEY: Is there anything else that you'd like to add?

ALF CELL LEADER: I think our general sentiments or objective are similar, to stop the destruction of life…. It's amazing to me we're having a conversation about violence in relation to the ALF and ELF when we have Monsanto and Dow Chemical, Exxon and companies who are hurting and murdering people with their by-products… I don't have hope. The fact were having a conversation about my tactics being extreme or violent while corporations are making a killing, literally and figuratively, and while their stocks are going through the roof, is amazing to me. To focus on us, that we are America top domestic terrorist threat, is amazing to me.

After the interview, the man sat down, still masked, and gave us details about an ALF crime. It turned out to be a break-in and theft of 33 beagles and 11 ferrets from a place called Marshall Farms in upstate New York. He said as they tried to gain entrance, they made a series of nicks and cuts into the fence surrounding the facility before realizing they had brought the wrong equipment, and scaled the fence. He called it a "rookie mistake."

60 Minutes confirmed that there was indeed a break-in and theft at Marshall Farms in North Rose, New York on December 5, 2001. Marshall Farms breeds animals for research and sale. Scott Marshall, a representative of the company, wouldn't discuss details of the crime and the New York State Police in Albany wouldn't release copies of the police report. But there were accounts of the crime in animal rights publications and the local press.

When pressed, the man mentioned another incident, this one all the way across the country in Salinas, California. He claimed his ALF cell "liberated 24 rabbits" from a breeder, and "the owner was sleeping 15 yards away when we did it." 60 Minutes found an account in the San Jose Mercury News from May 2001 about a break-in at medical research company outside Salinas in which more than two dozen rabbits were stolen. The San Diego Union Tribune reported that "activists struck while members of the family… were elsewhere on the property."

By Graham Messick